Sorbate

[Ernest T Bass]

I just purchased new Sorbate---CROSBY AND BAKER ---
the label says: 1/4 tsp per gallon to prevent re-fermentation.
Should I disregard this and add 1/2 tsp per gallon like everyone else does?
I think my problem with CO2 is that the wine is still fermenting, I checked the SpGr tonight and it has dropped from 1.025 to 1.022. Do I have to wait until all the sugar is converted to alcohol or will the high alcohol kill off the yeast at some point. What do you suggest.
Thanks for all the help
Semper Fi

 

[phat]

I just purchased new Sorbate---CROSBY AND BAKER ---
the label says: 1/4 tsp per gallon to prevent re-fermentation.
Should I disregard this and add 1/2 tsp per gallon like everyone else does?
I think my problem with CO2 is that the wine is still fermenting, I checked the SpGr tonight and it has dropped from 1.025 to 1.022. Do I have to wait until all the sugar is converted to alcohol or will the high alcohol kill off the yeast at some point. What do you suggest.
Thanks for all the help
Semper Fi

Hi bud. I have seen various suggested doses out there. I doubt it will hurt to use 1/2. But if your sg is still dropping it is still fermenting. Albeit possibly slowly. Were it me and I wanted the wine sweet I might add the extra and wait a week or two to ensure a stable sg before degassing again and bottling.

 

[FrankieBones]

Bud, I have always followed the directions on the label but when finishing wine I add sorbate IN ADDITION to K-meta. Are you planning on doing this? I am under the impression that k-sorbate and k-meta work best at finishing a wine when used together. Also, 1.022 SG tells me there's ALOT of sugar left. Do you not want to let it ferment to dry? I let all my wine finish fermenting completely instead of trying to stop the process. It might be safer to let all the sugar convert to alcohol (dry) then sweeten after if you like. I believe the alcohol content also plays a role in preserving the wine.

 

[phat]

Bud, I have always followed the directions on the label but when finishing wine I add sorbate In addition to K-meta. Are you planning on doing this? I am under the impression that k-sorbate and k-meta work best at finishing a wine when used together. Also, 1.022 SG tells me there's ALOT of sugar left. Do you not want to let it ferment to dry? Hence, you want to finish it while
It's still sweet?

Unless I am mistaken, he mentioned in another thread that he fermented to dry, sorbated, then back sweetened to 1.025

 

[farmer]

Let it go dry and back sweeten to taste, keep it simple

 

[Luc]

Sorbate does not stop fermentation.
Sorbate just prevents yeast from multiplying.
So if there are just a few yeast cells left in your wine they can not multiply and start a new colony and therefore fermentation.

This is why you should let a fermentation running until dry. Then wait and rack.
At that moment just very few yeast cells are left in the wine. Then you should use sulphite and sorbate so the yeast can not start again when you add sugar for sweetening.

Luc

 

[mmadmikes1]

Trying to stop a fermentation at 1.02 is not going to work, even he back sweeted to get it there.

 

[Wade E]

Im guessing from this that you had already added some when it went dry the first time? If so then it either was not done fermenting the first time or your sorbate was out oc date then. If you have already add some I have to admit Im not sure what to do in this situation as adding more might leave a taste in the wine but not adding any may not let you sweeten again without fermentation starting again. Always follow the instructions on the label.

 

[Turock]

And sorbate will not prevent refermentation if you haven't waited until your wine has cleared. You shouldn't sorbate a wine that has sediment because there is still too many yeast cells present for the sorbate to work as it's supposed to.

 

[Ernest T Bass]

Thanks to all!
phat: /thanks for all the information. After reading all the replies, I just may wait it out and see what happens
FrankieBones: I kept it in the primary to 1.010. I added k-meta and sorbate, I mixed them in some of the wine and poured the mixture in the carboy and racked the wine to the carboy on top of mixture. I could only get the wine to 1.000. Tried a starter with 1118 and it still wouldn't start up so I asumed it was finished fermenting. Backsweetened to 1.025
farmer & luc: Is it safe to let it go dry and after it is dry "pour" it thru a paint strainer into a bucket, then thru a funnel into the carboy. I have always left the fruit in the must until I transfer it to the carboy.
mmadmikes1: What do you think about adding another 1/4 tsp/gallon of sorbate?
Wade: It stopped fermenting at 1.000 and I couldn't get it started back up, tried 1118 in starter and assumed it was finished.
Turock: Thanks, I didn't know that, I have always added k-meta and sorbate when I transferred after 3 days of no change in SpGr
Thanks to all, ya'll are great !
Semper Fi

 

[mmadmikes1]

If you already sorbated, don't add more. It is still there and when you get to dry and rack. it will work then. It does not leave the wine or get used up. When you rack add K-Meta and wait 3 or 4 days and check to make sure its finished. I would not be in any hurry to bottle this wine. Age in carboy and avoid bottle bombs

 

[Wade E]

Thanks to all!
phat: /thanks for all the information. After reading all the replies, I just may wait it out and see what happens
FrankieBones: I kept it in the primary to 1.010. I added k-meta and sorbate, I mixed them in some of the wine and poured the mixture in the carboy and racked the wine to the carboy on top of mixture. I could only get the wine to 1.000. Tried a starter with 1118 and it still wouldn't start up so I asumed it was finished fermenting. Backsweetened to 1.025
farmer & luc: Is it safe to let it go dry and after it is dry "pour" it thru a paint strainer into a bucket, then thru a funnel into the carboy. I have always left the fruit in the must until I transfer it to the carboy.
mmadmikes1: What do you think about adding another 1/4 tsp/gallon of sorbate?


Wade: It stopped fermenting at 1.000 and I couldn't get it started back up, tried 1118 in starter and assumed it was finished.
Turock: Thanks, I didn't know that, I have always added k-meta and sorbate when I transferred after 3 days of no change in SpGr
Thanks to all, ya'll are great !
Semper Fi

Are you saying you added the sulfite and sorbate at 1.010? If so thats most likely the problem right there! You stunted the yeast for awhile but as the S02 level dropped the yeast came back to life and finished what it was doing. You have to wait until the yeast is done fermenting for at least 3 days and only thenm can you add sulfite and sorbate.

 

[Ernest T Bass]

Wade E: Boy, did I mess that post up. I should proff read my post. I moved it from the primary to the secondary at 1.010. It took about 3 days and it was at 1.000 and stayed their for about a week, that's when I added the 1118 as a starter and that didn't help any either. Sorry about leaving that one important fact out. I'm about convenced that it started back fermenting since my SpGr dropped 2 points. I'll just have to wait it out unless you have an idea?
Semper Fi

 

[Wade E]

1.000 is about where a lot of wines stop. I would not have bothered trying to do a starter with an sg of 1.000. There is so much alc at that point that adding even a really good starter yeast just gets shocked by the high abv unlike a yeast that has slowly acclimated itself to those conditions. Thats why we tell you guys to use a yeast cake like this to start other stuck wines or musts that will be difficult to start like a Skeeter Pee. Yeah, I think your other sorbate was old and didnt do what needed to be done. I have been where you are now and decided to get Champagne bottles and let the wine ferment a little in them and make sparkling wine as I was afraid to add any more sorbate but didnt like this wine dry either.

 

[Turock]

I'm very confused as to the procedure so many people seem to be using in regards to sorbate. Wine is supposed to age, clarify, and stabilize in the secondary before the use of sorbate.

When you get ready to bottle----THEN sorbate should be added. At that time, you can sorbate and sweeten and allow to sit for a week or so to be sure you're not going to have sediment or referm, I guess you can do that. But a properly aged,clarified and stabilized wine is not going to referm when sugar and sorbate is added. We've never had a refermentation start on us because all our wines are about 1 year old before bottling and sweetening are even attempted.

Don't sorbate cloudy,young wines that have sediment. That is the incorrect procedure for using sorbate.