Here's my dilemma!

[Flem]

I have a 6 gallon Chilean Carmenere (juice bucket) that I started last March. It has been aging gracefully for several months. I am now getting ready to bottle it and decided to check the pH, TA and SO2 levels to make sure they were in range.
The pH tested at a perfect 3.55. However, when I did the TA test (twice), it came out to .49% which is well below the ideal range of .60% to .70% for a dry red.
My dilemma is: How can I increase (and by how much) the TA without adversely affecting the pH? I have both Acid Blend and Tartaric acid to use. I'm not sure which is best.
Thanks in advance!!

 

[djrockinsteve]

Have you tasted it? Though it's low in acid it may be ok. Adjusting the acid % will change your ph. I'm not schooled in which specific acid to add but I would whip out the ol' Pearson Square and see what acid blend would do for everything.

 

[Rocky]

That is a tough call Flem. I agree with Steve. If it tastes good, don't mess with it. It is not that far out of the ideal range, anyway. It is like taking points off the scoreboard from a field goal when there is a penalty. More often than not, it results in no points.

 

[grapeman]

My vote is to leave it alone.

 

[robie]

I also agree. Taste test it. If it tastes good, just leave it where it is.

Acid (taste) is more important than the actual value of PH, but only as long as PH is still in an acceptable range.

Also, you can take a small sample (one glass) and add a crystal or two of tartaric acid, stir it and taste it. That will tell you what difference in taste you may achieve if you adjust the acid.

If you do decide to adjust the acid, only add half as much as called for in your calculations. Then, check acid and PH again. Other than the fact that PH will drop, you never know exactly how much the PH will change for a given amount of additional acid, so go carefully and slowly.

 

[rhoffart]

perfect 3.55. However, when I did the TA test (twice), it came out to .49%

From the little I know, I would need to know your tasting notes.

You have to ask yourself, what will aging do to this wine? How will it taste 1 or 2 years from now?

That is too close to call by the numbers.

 

[Flem]

I did taste it and it was pretty good for a young wine. I'm thinking I might add a little tartaric acid to bump it up a little and reduce the pH yet still keep it above 3.4

 

[rhoffart]

I did taste it and it was pretty good for a young wine. I'm thinking I might add a little tartaric acid to bump it up a little and reduce the pH yet still keep it above 3.4

Just go easy ... some say go half, I say 1/4. You can always add more.

 

[Wade E]

You can add some, it shouldnt change it that much and I like your idea of going for 3.4 not that Id be worried about eithe of thoise #'s you have now but if youi can balance it better then why not just dont blow it and make a mistake!!!! LOL I dont want to see a \new thread tomorrow morning stating " OOOPs, I added to much acid"!

 

[ibglowin]

That is close enough IMHO. I am not sure I would mess with it especially at this point. Adjustments should always be done before fermentation or ASAP afterwards so things can get integrated together better. Tartaric only, no acid blend. Again I vote Que Sera, Sera on this one!

 

[MrWino]

Flem
Did you get that from Luva Bella? Thats where I got mine. I bought 12 gallons and I clarified and bottled 6 gallons after about 6 months- excellant wine. I have the other one in cold storage and clarifying now. I will probably bottle it soon. I added oak to it and it increased the flavor nicely. I checked the acid levels in mine with a titration kit and it was around .60.

 

[JohnT]

Flem,

I agree with all of the above, if you like the taste, then do nothing!.

The TA test measures the amount (by weight, in grams per liter) of acid in your wine. The PH test tells you what the strength of the total acid in the wine. If your PH is perfect, and your TA is too low, then this is because the acid in the wine is strong, so not as much is needed.

Think of it like gasoline. Although the tank reads "full", the distance you can travel can be greater with premium then with regular.

In my opinion, TA tests are not really needed when you have a PH test. The PH test is a much more acurate and meaningful. I would always prefer the results of the PH meter to the results of a TA test. Just take care in calibration and perform the test several times for consistant results.

Others may disagree, but I have never heard of a strong arguement for the need of doing both tests (except to verify that the PH meter is working).

Your wine is fine. Enjoy!

 

[rhoffart]

That is close enough IMHO. I am not sure I would mess with it especially at this point. Adjustments should always be done before fermentation or ASAP afterwards so things can get integrated together better. Tartaric only, no acid blend. Again I vote Que Sera, Sera on this one!

But what if it already tastes soft, mellow, flabby or smooth? I'm asking due to the lack of experience. Wouldn't you base this decision strictly off of taste?

 

[robie]

But what if it already tastes soft, mellow, flabby or smooth? I'm asking due to the lack of experience. Wouldn't you base this decision strictly off of taste?

Taste is what you want, but the wine should remain at an acceptable PH, otherwise, bacteria can result.

So, if it doesn't taste right, experiment, but make sure the resulting PH is within the normal range.

Balance!!!

In your case, I doubt this wine is far enough off to taste flabby, but I do understand you are just trying to learn.

I personally wouldn't adjust the acid level of this wine, but I definitely would experiment with a glass of it and some tartaric acid, just as a learning experience. I do this regularly with acid, tannins and sometimes Biolees.

As already mentioned, never add acid blend after fermentation, especially if you didn't add sorbate. Use tartaric.

 

[Julie]

........As already mentioned, never add acid blend after fermentation, especially if you didn't add sorbate. Use tartaric.

Why tartaric and not acid blend after fermentation?

 

[JohnT]

Tartaric acid is native to grapes.

Acid blend contains tartaric, but also other acids like citric. I find that acid blend is much more harsh.

 

[ibglowin]

If it tasted flabby then by all means but he said it tasted fine. The acid is pretty darn close to textbook numbers, so close I dont think you would taste much difference even if if you brought it up to .60.

But what if it already tastes soft, mellow, flabby or smooth? I'm asking due to the lack of experience. Wouldn't you base this decision strictly off of taste?

 

[rhoffart]

If it tasted flabby then by all means but he said it tasted fine. The acid is pretty darn close to textbook numbers, so close I dont think you would taste much difference even if if you brought it up to .60.

I'm sure your correct. I was just trying to over analyze again. Maybe a little mind reading. What prompted the question?

 

[Flem]

Okay guys!! I read and re-read all of your responses. After looking at all the experience that was associated with those who responded, I decided to "leave well enough alone". As a matter of fact, I just got finished bottling it. Thanks to all of you for your help.


Yes, It was from L'uva Bella.

 

[robie]

Why tartaric and not acid blend after fermentation?

Sorry it took so long to get back, Julie.

I read several places that acid blend has some element that can sometimes restart fermentation. (Don't ask me which one because I don't remember.) This only applies to post-fermentation addition. However, if sorbate is added before the acid blend, adding acid blend is not a problem.