Malolactic fermentation

[Runningwolf]

Since there are quiet a few members attempting this for the first time in the next few weeks, is there any advice someone can give us on proper procedures.

When racking to the secondary do you rack off all of the sediment? I've read temps should be about 65*-75*. Do not use L 1118 yeast. Does the carboy need to be topped up during this process with no sulfites? How does the tests work and what numbers are you shooting for on them?

 

[Wannabe]

Wonderful suggestion.

 

[Flem]

Excuse me Wannabe for redirecting this thread back to its original intent. I believe Dan's questions pertain to the steps in MLF (malolactic fermentation) and not to general wine making procedures. Again, I apologize but there are many who are going to be using this type of fermentation in the near future.

 

[Wannabe]

Sorry. You are correct. I was very interested in his question and my mind just went racing. Didn't mean to carried away

 

[Wade E]

Yo want to carry over some sediment as the malo lactic bacteria use this for nutient. You should have this topped up as this fermentaion produces very little C02 and there is very low sulfite levels at this time. Ive never heard of the EC1118 yeast not being used. I dont recommend using any sulfites as it can hider the bacteria. Check out the tutoarials for MLF as far as testing, they are very good and informative videos and can show you better then anyone could explain it probably.

 

[winemaker_3352]

I have no experience with this - but i have read that the Lalvin D-47 is great if you are looking at doing MLF.

 

[Runningwolf]

The use of Citric acid or Lalvin EC 1118 yeast is not recommended if you intend to have Malolactic fermentation. EC-1118 produces SO2 that can interfere with a malolactic fermentation

This is the link.

 

[Wade E]

Dan you are right, the EC1118 inhibits ML fermentation and Jon is also right, that yeats prefers MLF. I dont use either of thiose yeasts.

 

[Flem]

Dan, What type of yeast comes in the juice buckets from L'uva Bella? Will it hinder MLF?

 

[Runningwolf]

I do not know. It is already added when they come in so I am just running with it.

 

[Julie]

Dan, didn't Frank or Joey, not sure which one, tell us that they use 1118? I would swear that is what they said because you said that is what I use. I do believe it was Frank who made this comment. We were asking about adding yeast and he said not to because it was already added and if you did you would have to use the same yeast and that is when you said "1118 is what I use."

 

[Wade E]

I just did some research on this as I always do when I dont know the answer so that I am informed. Under low nutrient conditions this yeast actually produces higher levels of S02 in the wine which is why it inhibits MLF. So i you do use this yeast I recommend using a malolactic bacteria strain that has higher tolerances to S02 like Lalvin VP41 which has a high abv tolerance of 15% and S02 tolerance of 50 - 60 ppm.

 

[Racer]

Thanks for bringing up the topic about MLF now. I don't know if all the juice from chile is done this way but my source by me sells juice that is pre-innoculated with ec-1118 yeast. So Wades comments need to be followed if thats what folks will be working with. Here's a link to Midland that shows each variety is all set to go with the yeast already added in the juice for you. I haven't looked it back up but bacchus may be another mlf strain that can tolerate high So2 levels too. It has handled all my mlf's without a problem every time I've used that strain.

 

[Wade E]

If thats the case Id hit it with sulfite and add another yeast. Im not saying that because it wont work but just because 1118 isnt the greatest yeast fir bringing out the aspects of what each wine can. Below is a great link to selecting your yeast according to the type of wine you are making any what you want to accentuate.
https://docs.google.com/viewer?url=http://www.morewinemaking.com/public/pdf/wyeastpair.pdf&pli=1

 

[Tom]

I don't like juice buckets that already have yeast. I would add meta and make a starter of something like RC212 for reds.
Now if you plan on MLF on more that 4 buckets I would suggest lalvin VP41 or 33 as these pkg is good for 66 gallons and is much cheaper that getting 1 pkg per 6 gal.

 

[Racer]

I would normally pass on pre-innoculated juice too but I'm running low on white wine and I wanted to see how this vendor was to work with. The one shop in chicago I've dealt with before was a real PITA to work with on grape orders in past years. I talked with the vendor I gave a link for and what he told me was that the juice comes from the processor(Chile?) already set with the yeast in the juice. Since his order time line matches all the east coast suppliers time line I'm reading here I started to assume that the vendors you folks out east have are also getting the buckets that way too.It might pay to double check.

 

[Julie]

I would normally pass on pre-innoculated juice too but I'm running low on white wine and I wanted to see how this vendor was to work with. The one shop in chicago I've dealt with before was a real PITA to work with on grape orders in past years. I talked with the vendor I gave a link for and what he told me was that the juice comes from the processor(Chile?) already set with the yeast in the juice. Since his order time line matches all the east coast suppliers time line I'm reading here I started to assume that the vendors you folks out east have are also getting the buckets that way too.It might pay to double check.

I think you are right, I got a juice bucket last fall from Comsumers Produce and on the bucket it stated that the yeast was already added. So I'm thinking that the buckets are all coming that way as well.

 

[Runningwolf]

I don't like juice buckets that already have yeast. I would add meta and make a starter of something like RC212 for reds.
Now if you plan on MLF on more that 4 buckets I would suggest lalvin VP41 or 33 as these pkg is good for 66 gallons and is much cheaper that getting 1 pkg per 6 gal.

Tom when getting the cultures like this, how do you separate them. Its says very minimal air contact. Do you separate it dry or add it to a cup of wine and then separate.

 

[Wade E]

Just dont leave a package sitting on your workbench all day otherwise its fine either.

 

[Tom]

Tom when getting the cultures like this, how do you separate them. Its says very minimal air contact. Do you separate it dry or add it to a cup of wine and then separate.

They are dry. Just rehydrate them and add. I hydrate them in 11 shot glasses (why 11? if I had 11 6 gal carboys thats 66 gal thats what VP41 will do) then divide that into the number of carboys