WineXpert Question for you Raisin adders, Tweakers and other miscreants.

[rickswine]

I'm a newbe but after a lot of reading on here I also used Zante Currents in my red kits. Chopped them and put them in a strainer bag into the primary.

IMO, it comes down to personal preference but the input and suggestions offered is invaluable.

 

[jswordy]

I use the cheapest store brand black raisins I can buy. Kroger brand does not contain preservatives; neither do most store brands I have found.

In the U.S., if it contains a preservative that must be listed on the label in contents.

 

[olusteebus]

I bought some white raisins from Aldi's ( a chain in some states) that have no preservatives.

If I boil the raisins with oak, will it give more oak and raisin flavor than I may want?

 

[Runningwolf]

I just realized that you are talking about putting the raisins in the primary ,. It has been my experience or should I say trial and error, the secondary is where the raisin should know in you think of it as a second pressing or represso .the primary juice, and fermented and then the skins reused the second pressing, in my case I use the raisins as a second pressing not the primary to reach the full benefit in that position, in the secondary left whole is will they will give off their essence without conflicting fermentation process headed up in the primary , nor will they conflict with what the yeast is trying to accomplish in the primary, in my view it is like a conflict of interest , so the secondary is where I put it each and every time.

E

Hey Joe thats an interesting concept but if you're putting them in during the secondary you're risking fowling up a fermentation a lot quicker than if it was during the primary. I would be more concerned about a stuck fermentation than getting a good fermentation going with a starter. Maybe I'm missing something here. Another question Joe how many pounds of raisens do you use one a 6 gallon pail of Chilean Juice?

 

[joeswine]

Raisins in the secondary

Wolfman, the idea that once you finished your primary you know there is always still some activity that is what you capitalize on ,putting the raisins in the secondary brings out whatthe raisins add to the mix ,tis like making a sauce I have the base sauce made and just at the finish. I Add more seasonings to layer the sauce, with the raisins. It is the same thing . I have the base wine it is done fermenting but going to the secondary there is still some action from the primary, this you know, the alcohol that is produced will start rehydration and dissolve the sugars and extract the flavors from the raisins, and yes it will start a second fermentation on its own no stock fermentations. At least that has been my follow up with it ,. Once the raisins take hold yes it does become the second fermentation but a slight almost like a malic fermentation and to me that is what adds the depth and mouth feel that the raisins add to the wine, just like an amarone or represso valpolicella, at least that is my take on it – I worked with it . I have used it –I won my share metals with it. You know what I say always think outside the box ,give it a try Wolfman I think you will find something very different, the primary does not make any sense to me, that to me seems to be a conflict of interest between the juice, the yeast and the plan – you control the whole process . When do we swap my coffee port just won best of show at the Hammonton wine Festival.. Would you like to ?...........................a heavy 1lb. to 6 gallons

 

[Runningwolf]

Ok Joe I'm in on the secondary, you told me what I was asking for. I assume you're using (without going back a page) brown raisins. Have you used the currents others are talking about. I only ordered 10 pails (one each of the reds) and will be doing some blends and also making another port this year. Hey another idea I did on my last one before I sweetened it I added a couple bottles of 100% cherry juice to it (12 gallon batch).

Give me some time for things to calm down here a bit and we'll swap. I currently have at least 6 different ports.

 

[tonyt]

I add raisins to most of my kits. Red Flame Organic raisins from Whole Foods Market. I rinse lightly and add to primary in muslin bag. I usually add on day two of fermentation. Squeeze daily making sure to pop each raisin by end of ferment. I do not boil or chop. I add one pound per six gallon kit.

 

[joeswine]

rasins by any other name

SUN MAID RAISINS WORK WELL FOR ME,NO PROBLEMS THERE,DO YOU SEE HOW THE LAYERING OF COMPONENTS APPLIES?
THE BASE -PRIMARY
THE RAISINS -SECONDARY-EXTRACTION
THE POWERED OAK-SECONDARY FOR TEXTURE
TIME FOR MATURATION AND THEN ADJUST

THIS IS JUST MY WAY OF DOING THE PROCESS.

 

[GaDawg]

Sun-Maid Golden raisins are treated with sulfur dioxide.
http://www.sunmaid.com/frequently-asked-questions.html

 

[joeswine]

Sun maid raisins

I am not sure about the golden raisins, but the brown raisins. I use read as follows ingredients, California seedless raisins, raisins are mechanically steamed and may contain an occasional grapes stem or wood piece ,nothing more, except for the caloric intake .mine come in a 4 pounds split into two bags.

 

[Vpilieci]

How long should raisins be left?? I make my wine from fresh crushed juices and usually leave them in secondary for up to 6 months... is that appropriate? Or is it a bit much?

 

[olusteebus]

That is a long time. IT would probably give it a more raisin taste than you want. I would think 4 to 7 days would give you the body you want. And, you may not want that at all with fresh juice. The The tweaking I was talking about was for the less expensive kits that produce less body than others. I would do it to 4 and 6 week kits.

 

[TODDO]

What about raisins that have added oil? Sunflower or palm oil.
I have not been able to find any without it.
Is this a concern?

 

[Vpilieci]

That is a long time. IT would probably give it a more raisin taste than you want. I would think 4 to 7 days would give you the body you want. And, you may not want that at all with fresh juice. The The tweaking I was talking about was for the less expensive kits that produce less body than others. I would do it to 4 and 6 week kits.

Ok... then what I'll do is add Tannin tonight + oak chips. With the intention of leaving those for 3 months. In another 4-6 weeks I'll add the raisins and leave them for 4-6 weeks then rack and bulk age for another 4-6 months before bottling....

 

[olusteebus]

Ok... then what I'll do is add Tannin tonight + oak chips. With the intention of leaving those for 3 months. In another 4-6 weeks I'll add the raisins and leave them for 4-6 weeks then rack and bulk age for another 4-6 months before bottling....

I am sure someone will chime in here with more experience but That is a long time for it to sit on oak. I have really hurt some wine with too much oak. Hopefully it will mellow out. Also, I don't think you need raisins in it that long. You may not even need raisins if you are oaking it. Raisins are for body. Another way to add body is to toss in some bananas, skin and all.

Here are a couple of threads about using raisins

http://www.winemakingtalk.com/forum/f86/why-add-raisins-38092/

http://www.winemakingtalk.com/forum/f5/use-raisins-wine-recipes-10586/

Google "raisins winemakingtalk"

 

[Vpilieci]

Ok. the tannin is in. Ferm. is still happening. So, I'm happy. I'll oak in secondary for a week. Then test with wine theif.

But, I want to add raisins, even if just to say "I tried", plus I want a BIG red. How long should it sit on the raisins? Seriously, I don't want sweet wine, so I want sugars to ferment out. Now is the time to add the raisins... no??

 

[joeswine]

raisins in the wine

MY ask what was your SG when you added the raisins and only leave them in for two to three weeks, that should be enough time for the alcohol to extract the assents from them, adding the tannins at The same time 2 tablespoons to a 6 gallon mix is a enough to start with, what for very tinny bubbles at first then they will subside, test the sg very week and keep a good airlock on the process the rest is simple, GOT IT?

 

[Vpilieci]

The tannin is in now. I want it to break down through fermentation. It's all in a 55litre demijohn under airlock. Sanitation was flawless, I make beer too so I always have meta bisulphate, etc. handy. I will add the raisins in March. Then rack the wine off the lees in April. I'll oak in secondary after that, remove the chips and then bottle in Sept.

Thanks.

 

[Putterrr]

What about raisins that have added oil? Sunflower or palm oil.
I have not been able to find any without it.
Is this a concern?

Can anyone comment on the oil in raisins?

I have been looking for golden raisins but all have oil listed on the package. Yes Sun-Maid raisins do not but that does me no good if I can't find a store that sells them.

thx and cheers

 

[ShelleyDickison]

OK, I want to make sure I am understanding this right....Raisons both light and dark when put in secondary help with the body of the wine but doesn't leave a raison taste behind. Same with dried grape packs, correct. So does that hold true for any dried fruit. For example, I am making a white grape cherry wine, 5 gallon batch. I used 14 pounds of frozen cherries and white grape juice, it is still in primary which I stir and press the fruit a minimum of twice a day. Would it be beneficial to try and find dried cherries (providing all ingredients listed on the package are ok ) and use say a pound or so in secondary to add body? Is this also beneficial to lower end wine kits like the Mist or Breezin Kits, which are a majority of the ones I make? How do you know which ones it will benefit, or is a trial and error thing? Thanks