Chemical overload?

[Boozehag]

Ive been trying to get my potato wine to clear and it wont. I used kwikclear....twice, then I treated it for pectin haze, still nothing, so I tested it and treated it for startch haze and guess what, still nothnig.

Should I could I treat it with kwikclear again or just leave it. Ive had so much conflciting advice, warm it up, cool it down etc....any help appreciated

 

[Wade E]

I woud not do use another fining agent on it. What temp did you take it to as far as cool and for how long?

 

[Boozehag]

10 degrees for two weeks. I stored it in my garage, may have been even cooler.

 

[Wade E]

Yeh, that would surely have been cold enough! I really dont think this batch is going to clear butthere is 1 more thing to try if you really want to give t a go and that is to try bentonite as its a possible protein haze, I usually add some bentonite in primary for this purpose and to help drop out some solids earlier.

 

[Boozehag]

Already used that! Must be stubborn I guess. Just worried that I have loaded it up too much now so might as well biff it..its only 4.5l so not a huge loss! Tastes alright though.

 

[Luc]

When you say potato the first thing that comes to my mind is starch.

Try alfa-amylase a special enzyme to break down starch.

Luc

 

[smurfe]

Yeh, that would surely have been cold enough! I really dont think this batch is going to clear butthere is 1 more thing to try if you really want to give t a go and that is to try bentonite as its a possible protein haze, I usually add some bentonite in primary for this purpose and to help drop out some solids earlier.

She probably meant 10 C which is around 50F.

 

[smurfe]

When you say potato the first thing that comes to my mind is starch.

Try alfa-amylase a special enzyme to break down starch.

Luc

Could you explain this a little more? I brew beer all grain and when I mash my grains, alpha amylase is one of the enzyme steps created by the temperature mash. Alpha Amylase is a sugar producing enzyme though. Protease is an enzyme that breaks up large proteins that cause haze. This is all based on beer brewing though and at a specific pH range that the mash may be. That is one of the important factors of getting your mash pH within the range around 5.2 or so. I would be interested to hear more about the use of these enzymes in winemaking. I pulled this chart info from John Palmer's How To Brew. One of my beer brewing bibles.

Table 11 - Major Enzyme Groups and FunctionsEnzyme
Optimum
Temperature
Range Working pH Range
Function

Phytase
86-126°F
5.0-5.5
Lowers the mash pH. No longer used.

Debranching (var.)
95-113°F
5.0-5.8
Solubilization of starches.

Beta Glucanase
95-113°F
4.5-5.5
Best gum breaking rest.

Peptidase
113-131°F
4.6-5.3
Produces Free Amino Nitrogen (FAN).

Protease
113-131°F
4.6-5.3
Breaks up large proteins that form haze.

Beta Amylase
131-150°F
5.0-5.5
Produces maltose.

Alpha Amylase
154-162°F
5.3-5.7
Produces a variety of sugars, including maltose.

 

[Luc]

I have found a great link for you:

http://www.science-projects.com/Amylase.htm

Basically it comes down to the fact that starch is a long molecule. They are natures way to store sugar for when needed in the future. Alfa amylase breaks it down in smaller molecules. Therefore it is probably called a sugar producing enzyme.

More info can be obtained from Wikki:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alpha-Amylase

Interesting is also the fact that it is found in human Saliva.
So I do not dare to suggest it, but I still do: spitting in the wine may help ::
Actually I recall someone on another forum who did this (long time ago) and it worked

Luc

 

[Wade E]

If that is 50* degress F then that was not cold enough but I dought it will do much anyway.

 

[Boozehag]

Yes I did mean 10 C forgot you lot work in farenheit. Hard to get things much colder around here as its only autumn, winter will be better for such things. I suppose i culd always put it in the fridge!

Thanks for the tips Luc, dont think I will spit in it though...just cant bring myself to be unladylike enough!

I did test it for starch with the iodine and then treated it for such, it just doesnt want to clear. It was just an experiment before I could go get sme fruit at the time so Im not too worried if I have to tip it down the sink!

 

[Wade E]

Just ause its cloudy doesnt mean you have to dump it, if it tastes good drink it in the dark!

 

[Skyhawk]

I agree with Wade. Plus if it is a protein haze, the worst that might happen is that you might gain a bit of muscle mass.

 

[Boozehag]

Lol didnt see these replies until now! Yes will drink this in the dark I think! Im looking for soem nice silver or pottery goblets so I dont have to look at it!

Muscle mass....hmmm not so sure I want that!!!