A Legal Question

[tatud4life]

Have a question about the possibility of selling wine. I know that selling other forms of alcohol is highly frowned upon by the government. I am assuming that the same goes for wine. I didn't know if there was any difference since wine making is basically a natural process and other forms are mechanical in nature. I'm not talking about selling mass quantities across the world. Just maybe the occasional sell to some friends just to help recoup the cost of the additives and equipment. Any guidance is very welcome. Thanks in advance!!

 

[Rocky]

TT4L, you need to check your state laws as the laws governing the sale of wine vary from state to state. You might try batering with your wine on a quid pro quo basis.

 

[tatud4life]

Thanks guys! I figured that was the situation. I'm sure I can get "reimbursed" by my friends for my efforts. As far as my conscience, Uncle Sam gets enough from me for it not to keep me up at night. I will check the state laws here and see what it says. Thanks again guys!!

 

[roadwarriorsvt]

Remember, its only illegal if you get caught!

 

[tatud4life]

Exactly!!!

 

[dangerdave]

I make wine for a few close peoples. I do not sell it. They pay for the kit, bottles, corks, labels, etc, and I make it in my cellar. I repeat, "I make wine for people".

It's all in the verbage.

 

[tatud4life]

It's always in how you word things. I've learned that the hard way with my wife sometimes. Lol I'll see how it goes. Nobody might like my wine or SP. I highly doubt it with the SP, but you never know. At least my wife has it in her mind that she will have an unlimited supply of alcohol.

 

[DoctorCAD]

Advertising an illegal activity on an open internet sight is really stupid.

 

[tatud4life]

Who is advertising? I was simply curious if the law applying tithe sale of other forms of alcohol differed from the sale of wine. I didn't know if wine making being a natural process had any differences.

 

[JohnT]

Don't be an idiot!

Guys,

A very close freind of mine had all of the wine making equipment, wine stock, and supplies seized by the police! I do not want to even talk about the fines he ended up paying.

This was a couple of years ago. He did as was suggested in this thread and only sold to friends. The problem is that one of his fiends had a friend that was a cop. You simply can not count on other people to keep their mouths shut or to whom they might "give a taste" of wine.

I NEVER SELL WINE TO ANYONE, EVEN TO MY OWN FATHER OR BROTHER! If they want wine bad enough, have them get their own supplies and then you can make wine together. just do not accept even a dime for finished product!

Any other way, unless you have a license, IS ILLEGAL! I do not believe that there is a single state that allows for the manufacture and sale of an alcoholic beverage without a license.

Be safe, be legal, and have fun!

 

[tatud4life]

Thank you John!!! That is the whole reason that I posed the question in the first place. I wanted to make sure that I didn't do anything that would jeopardize mine or my family's well being. Not to find ways to circumvent the law. Although I do think that too much of my hard earned money is taken by the powers that be, I'm not going to do anything to put my family at risk of anything. If anything, I'm making wine to save myself some money. I have to support my wife's addiction! Lol. Just kidding.

I didn't know if wine making being a natural process made any difference in the eyes of the law. I didn't assume that it did and I hadn't done the research to find out, but I did think this would be the best place to start looking. I was not trying to find an end run around any laws or advertise any intent to do so by myself or anyone here. I apologize if that was perceived!! Not only to I not want to risk my freedom and finances, I don't want to put anyone here at risk either!!

 

[cindy]

if the so called powers that be could find a way to get their cut it wouldn't be illegal.
same go's for another well known substance! its all about the all mighty dollar.....just like higher taxing of cigs,soda, fast food etc...
they don't give a shite about your health they want more of your money.. they play the health card to justify stealing more of your income...

 

[tatud4life]

Exactly Cindy!!! I don't want this to turn political or anything, but that was the real reason that the other substance was deemed illegal in the first place. No taxes were being paid on the sale of it. Yes, there is health risks if it isn't produced correctly, but taxes was the real reason behind it. That is fine though. I will drink whatever my wife leaves me.

BTW Cindy, I checked the lid for the primary and it does not have a run on the bottom. I thought it did, but I was wrong. Sorry. :'(

 

[robie]

IMPORTANT NOTICE

The opinions expressed on this thread are just that - opinions; opinions of individuals and not endorsed in any way by the forum's management or owner.

No response on this or any other thread of this forum should not be construed as valid legal advice.

The forum in no manner condones or upholds any illegal practices.

In order to legally make wine for sale, all required local, state, and federal laws must be adhered to fully. No one should consider engaging in making wine for sales without first acquiring legal representation.

 

[tatud4life]

WOW!!! This thread has gone well beyond what I originally intended! I was just looking for an answer to a question. I have my answer and a whole lot more.

 

[JohnT]

if the so called powers that be could find a way to get their cut it wouldn't be illegal.
same go's for another well known substance! its all about the all mighty dollar.....just like higher taxing of cigs,soda, fast food etc...
they don't give a shite about your health they want more of your money.. they play the health card to justify stealing more of your income...

Another card they play... "It's for the children". Just how much lottery money actually goes to fund schools? (which is why they said that they needed it in NJ)?

We recently had a series of renevations to our only school in town. $26 million! This is an elementry school for 800 students (K through 8) and all of that money was to go to renevations of what currently exists.

This will not add a single new classroom, just update existing ones.

This was above and beyond the current school budget.

This is also a state where we have the highest per capita property taxes in the nation.

Let's do the math...

26,000,000 divided by 800 is 32,500 per student. That is more than most colleges charge per year!

Well that's new jersey for ya. Someone's pockets got very heavy on this deal!

 

[cindy]

this is interesting
In order to sell your wine you must be registered as a Bonded Wine Cellar (BWC). Alcohol is taxed by the federal government via excise taxes. So, while you cannot sell your own finely crafted home-made wine you are permitted to take it off your premises to organized affairs, exhibitions or competitions, such as home winemaker’s contests, tastings or judgings. Remember that under no circumstances can your wine be sold or offered for sale at these or any other venue. If you do wish to sell your wine it is heavily suggested that you have your wine made by a BWC to help save on the cost of licenses, taxes and other fees.
How much can I make legally?
To most accurately answer this question you should check local statutes as the amounts legal to make will vary. Most states allow federal law to dictate their own law. Other states amended the federal law but still permit between 100 and 200 gallons of wine at home. The overall amount is usually determined by the number of persons in the household who are of drinking age.
Believe it or not but there are still some states that refuse to legalize home wine making. Alabama and Mississippi are the only remaining states where making your own wine and beer at home are still illegal as a hobby. All other states allow some homemade wine and beer to be crafted. Most states allow home wine makers to share their wine with their family and guests within certain legal parameters.
In Tennessee and Texas, as in most other states, they allowed the federal law to determine their state law with regards to legal amounts to make. Idaho law states that beer made from “native materials” is legal. What they mean by native materials can be found out by calling their local regulation agency.
The last two states to legalize the hobby of home wine making are Oklahoma and Utah. Both states, within the past 10 years, legalized homemade wine and beer much to the delight of their residents.

 

[JohnT]

IMPORTANT NOTICE

The opinions expressed on this thread are just that - opinions; opinions of individuals and not endorsed in any way by the forum's management or owner.

No response on this or any other thread of this forum should not be construed as valid legal advice.

The forum in no manner condones or upholds any illegal practices.

In order to legally make wine for sale, all required local, state, and federal laws must be adhered to fully. No one should consider engaging in making wine for sales without first acquiring legal representation.

HERE, HERE! It is simply not worth violating any existing laws for a hobby!

 

[JohnT]

Cindy,

This goes all the way back to prohabition. Most folks do not realize that home wine making (for personal consumption) was legal during those dark days. They were, though, very specific about what was legal and what was not. Selling of any alcohol was a big no-no (just ask elliot ness or al capone).

 

[cindy]

WOW!!! This thread has gone well beyond what I originally intended! I was just looking for an answer to a question. I have my answer and a whole lot more.

I've learned a lot from this thread! you asked a good question isn't that why we read forums is to learn? I never once thought to google this topic and whats associated with it until now and I learned some things

In 1919 President Woodrow Wilson signed into law the 18th Amendment to the United States Constitution. This enacted what would be known as the Prohibition Era (1919-1933). The 18th Amendment outlawed the manufacturing and consumption of alcoholic beverages “for beverage purposes.” This resulted in breweries, vineyards and distilleries, across the country, being closed down or used to make malt for non-alcoholic purposes.
Based on an IRS ruling in 1920, the making of wine was looked upon more graciously. That ruling changed the standards for allowable alcoholic content in wine and cider but not beer. Beer was not allowed to have an alcoholic content higher than 0.5%.
Franklin Delano Roosevelt repealed Prohibition in 1933 when he signed into law the 21st Amendment. However, not contained within that amendment was the legalization of home beer making (home wine and cider making were both legalized at that time).
Home brewing of beer was finally legalized in 1978 when President Jimmy Carter signed bill, H.R. 1337, which repealed Federal restrictions on home-made beer and excise taxes on small amounts of home-made wine and beer. However, even with the passages of the 21st Amendment and H.R. 1337, states were charged with regulating alcohol within their own borders. As a result some states have not legalized home wine making or home brewing of beer even to this day.