Stuck Cranberry Wine

[PCharles]

Well, I finally have a stuck batch.

I started my cranberry wine Saturday, five days ago. I had 3.5 gallons of cranberry juice and berries. My SG was 1.095 and the pH was rather low, 2.75. I added lelavin 1118 yeast using a yeast hydration procedure. Yeast nutrient and energizer were added. After seeing now activity, I've attempted make a more hospital brew by adding additional water. I was able to increase the pH to 3.0. I added disolved sugar to bring up the SG to 1.085. I also added a second dose of the same yeast. It's been 24 hrs from these changes and fermentation is still amoungst the missing. I've also been stiring 3 times per day.

I also put the fermenter in front of my fire logs to increase the temp. It's been rather warm this week with interior temp currently at 72F. I figure I'll wait another couple of days in hope of fermentation.

This is now a 6 gallon batch with a fruit bag holding berries.

Any suggestions?

Paul

 

[Arne]

Maybe dump in a little nutrient and make a yeast starter with your must. Make it in a quart jar or bigger, add some of your must a little nutrient, maybe a little sugar and pitch your yeast in. It should take off if not, maybe you have a bad bunch of yeast. If it takes off, keep adding a little must til your jar is fairly full and pitch it into the primary. I don't know, but cranberries mite be one of those things that people have a hard time starting. You can also start your yeast with just some sugar water, when it takes off start adding a little must. Keep adding over a few hours and pitch it. Good luck with it, Arne.

 

[robie]

What is your recipe? - Don't know the source of your juice - fresh/frozen/concentrate/..etc, but maybe juice was sulfited or already had sorbate in it.

Give us some more info about it.

 

[cpfan]

OK, the SG started at 1.095, then you added water and sugar and brought it back to 1.085. So had it been fermenting? Did you take an sg at that point?

So what is the current sg? What is the temperature of the wine (not the room)?

Steve

 

[PCharles]

Sorry for not providing all the details. I used fresh cranberries... about 14 pounds. I chopped them in my food processer, cooked them a wee bit to break it up, then added it to the fermentor. I just reread the Sept Oct issue of WineMaker Magazine. They discussed problems with stuck fermentation. The issue also discussed pH problems. I'm thinking my pH may be too low. I have some NaCarbonate (not KCarbonate). The effect should be similar. I'm planning to add a bit to see if I can't raise the pH to 3.5. At this point I believe I should add a new dose of yeast. I'll be adding the yeast to a grape juice concentrate along with a portion of must. I'll continue to raise the must concentration for a several days, then add it to the must. Hopefully this will get it going.

 

[FTC Wines]

PCharles, I had the same problem with my Cranberry this week. PH 3.o, temp. too low, 67.5*, EC 1118 etc. But I was doing a Welches froz. concord grape wine at the same time, which was next to the Cranberry & 2 days ago I took a cup of the Welches which was fermenting rapidly & put it into the Cranberry wine. Next AM the Cranberry was fermenting & even had a cap. Do a froz. WHITE grape starter if you don't want to alter the taste as much as I probably did. Roy

 

[PCharles]

OK, the SG started at 1.095, then you added water and sugar and brought it back to 1.085. So had it been fermenting? Did you take an sg at that point?

So what is the current sg? What is the temperature of the wine (not the room)?

Steve

Seve, this batch never started fermenting. Cuttent SG is still at 1.085. Last night I did add some Na Carbonate. I was able to raise the pH from 3.00 to 3.20. Now I've tried two process to raise the pH, adding additoinal H2O and addition of carbonate.

This AM I've noticed what appears to be small signs of fermentation. I also have another batch of yeast that I am nursing along. I'm adding must to this yeast gradually to acclimate it to the finaly must content. So far it is still kicking. I started with some red grape concentrate to sweeten the starter followed by a bit of must. This is a different yeast strain as I'm out of the original strain 1118. The new one is RC 212, perhaps not the best choice. You might say I'm punting.

Temps outside have dropped considerably over night. Room temp has dropped to 68. Must temp is also now 68. I fired up the gas logs.

I don't have another must ferminting now from which I can stell some active yeast unless you think the yeast from my Christmas beer will work. Naaa.

I'd love to see this fermentation kick off. One way or the other, it has been a good learning experience. I believe I'll be buying some K-Carbonate for next season for sure.

Thanks for the suggestions.

Paul

 

[Midwest Vintner]

I've never seen 1118 NOT ferment, so if it doesn't go, nothing will. I have never tried fermenting a batch of must that was so high in acid though. I did have cranberry stuck once with cotes de blanc and added 1116 to get it going. pH was 3.3 though. I think cranberries have a natural resistance to yeast (acidity and sulfites).

 

[WineYooper]

Looking at my records I found I had used 1116 for my first batch and 1118 for the last one I made. Both show that I had issues trying to get it to start. The first batch did not start until I used 1118. Common to both to get them to go was getting the must temp to around 75 and making a good starter first with water and then adding small amounts of must to it till you have a strong ferment going and last but not least add to the must when there is no larger than a 10 degree difference between the two. Invest in a brew belt as well, I have to use this from fall to spring to help my ferments get going and I also have to wrap towels around and on top of the primary for insulation. I let my house drop to 60 at night. You can read other posts and find some have set up automatic temp controls for this but I am still in manual and use an infrared gun to monitor and plug and unplug as needed.
Never have checked my ph so don't have a clue about that interaction. In both cases it took about 14 hours before I saw any action.

 

[Midwest Vintner]

temp plays a role, but pH I think is the bigger factor. The lalvin yeasts go down to pretty cool temps fermenting. Once you get under 3.2 pH, yeast isn't as happy. If you don't have a pH meter, what wineyooper said is probably best. Make starter and get the temp right.

 

[PCharles]

Good news friends!!! I worked late tonight, a coworkers young one was sick. I just got home at 02:00 AM. Much to my delight, there was a nice red cap atop my cranberry wine!!! I made sure to feed it with some more Fermax... feed me I'm hungry they yelped. I'm sure glad that fermentation is finally started. This is day 5 since yeast was added.

Darn, I believe I'll be saving this cranberry wine for years to come as I sure as heck don't want to go through this ordeal again.

If I ever do this again, I will make sure the pH is over 3.2 by adding K-Carbonate. I will also consider adding 25% of apple cider to aid in the starting of fermentation.

If, by tomorow morning, if fermentation had not started, I was ready to head down to the apple orchard to pick up several gallons of apple cider. Blending with cider up front might be a good idea.

All right, I'm sure releaved that fermentation has started. This will be my last wine for the 2011 season. Beer will be the next to occupy my fermenter until 2012.

I may add a few more comments as my cranberry wine progresses. For now I'm relieved and ready for bed. Heck, it is 2:30 AM.

Good night,

Paul

 

[docanddeb]

Did you add acid blend to the batch too? I saw the recipes in another post. Cranberry is of the same family (sort of) as blueberry. It's a natural element Benzoate that is causing the problem... PLUS the low PH. Unless you make a roaring starter, then add a little of the cranberry to it over 24 hrs, you may not get it going at this point. You could also add some white grape or apple frozen concentrate to dilute the Benzoate and make it more hospitable for the yeast...

Best of luck!

Debbie

 

[PCharles]

Did you add acid blend to the batch too? I saw the recipes in another post. Cranberry is of the same family (sort of) as blueberry. It's a natural element Benzoate that is causing the problem... PLUS the low PH. Unless you make a roaring starter, then add a little of the cranberry to it over 24 hrs, you may not get it going at this point. You could also add some white grape or apple frozen concentrate to dilute the Benzoate and make it more hospitable for the yeast...

Best of luck!

Debbie

Hi Debbie,

After taking the pH I decided not to add any acid. Actually, I added carbonate to raise the pH. I also added a 3rd starter that I took extra care to make sure was well under way and aclimated to doses of the cranberry must. It finally lit up and has now fermented to my satisfaction. I've moved it to the secondary where it is sitting on about an inch of lees. I figure I will rack it off later this week. Before putting the wine in the secondary I removed the bag with the skins, which I gently pressed. I've not taken another pH since placing it in the secondary, but feel that it must be pretty low.

I need to go back and adjust that recipe. The next time I do cranberry I'll consider adding some apple cider along with it to raise the pH at the get go.

I'm sure glad that my first attempt with craberry wine didn't end up going down the drain. It was a real challenge and a good learning experience.

 

[docanddeb]

YEAH!!
I pitched this morning and I see bubbles... thank goodness... otherwise, I have a cherry going too and could have used a little of that to get it roaring too.
I always say...

you learn far more from 1 mis-step, than by accidently doing it right 100 times!!

Next year, we can all have cranberry wine to drink!

Debbie