Secondary Fermentation Duration

[Flafemina]

I am making wine from juice, red. The instruction the merchant handed me looks very generic because it says to let the wine ferment in the secondary carboy from 3 weeks to 60 days. That's incredible broad and I have no idea if I should move on to the next step sooner or later. It's a Cab/Noir nix.

 

[Flafemina]

In addition the only thing it says for next step is to transfer from 6 gal carboy to 5 gal carboy. Nothing about additive or stopping fermentation. That instructs me to leave it like that for 60 to 90 days. Any advice?

 

[Thig]

I would guess they said 3 weeks to 60 days because they have no idea how fast the sediments will settle to the bottom. If say after 4 weeks it looks like most of the sediments (lees) have settled to the bottom then you could transfer (rack) to another carboy. They are probably assuming you will have about one gallon of sediment (lees) on the bottom which you do not want to transfer so they say go from a 6 gallon to a 5 gallon. Basically you want to rack off the top 5 gallons and leave the bottom with the sediment.

I would probably check the SG with the hydrometer to make the fermentation has basically stopped before I transfered from the 6 gallon to the 5 gallon.

 

[wyntheef]

duration in the secondary could be as short as a few weeks if fermenting is done (check w/ hydrometer) or as long as a few months if you wanted to age it further in the carboy, so technically, the instructions are ok.

if a 5 gallon carboy will hold the quantity you are transferring with a bit of headspace, it's fine, but if it won't you will have to adjust with either a bigger carboy,or a 5 gallon carboy and a smaller jug for leftover.

 

[pete1325]

I'm not sure where your at in the process so I'll assume you just got the juice.....The juice buckets were probably kept in a refrigerated area and will more then likely start to ferment on wild yeast once you bring it to room temp. You can go through "primary fermentation" in the bucket it came in. What I normally do is wait until the juice is room temp....maybe overnight, then throw in some Pectic Enzyems, wait 12 hours (or so), pitch yeast (RC 212) then some yeast nutrients and let is ferment to dry, don't worry about "stopping fermentation" it should stop on it's own. This process migh take a week, keep in mind that "dry" is when the SG stays constant (.999 or less) for 3 days then rack to a carboy. You can leave it in bulk storage for a while.....others will chime in regarding Kmeta, degasing, etc, etc.

 

[Flafemina]

I introduced yeast about 8 days ago. The SG was down to 1.000 then I transferred to glass carboy been in carboy for 3 days now. Still some activity now but I never added nutrients just yeast that's it.

 

[robie]

I introduced yeast about 8 days ago. The SG was down to 1.000 then I transferred to glass carboy been in carboy for 3 days now. Still some activity now but I never added nutrients just yeast that's it.

The activity you see could be just CO2 bubbling off and the fermentation could be finished. This bubbling can last several days. That's why you should use your hydrometer. When the SG hasn't changed for 3 days in a row, and the SG is at or below 1.000, fermentation is finished.

This is a juice bucket. Even if the wine is fully fermented, I would leave the wine in secondary for the minimum 3 weeks. Nice characteristics are imparted to the wine during secondary. If you rack as soon as fermentation is done, the wine could miss out on these. Just keep the wine under air lock and don't be opening the carboy.

Once you are ready to rack, you will need to stabilize the wine. I can't imagine the instructions not informing you of this fact.

 

[Flafemina]

The only other instruction is after the 2nd rack to add potassium meta bisulfide but that's not until 120 days from now.

 

[dave1117]

You said Secondary Fermentation which is MaloLActic Fermentation (MLF). Thisis the process that can take from a few weeks to a few months. You can check the SG all you want and it should be 1.000 or less from the point you put it in your carboy and put an air lock on it. If you rack and treat with Meta prior to the completion of MLF, your wine will never develop fully and be unstable. You need to get and MLF quick test or better yet a paper chromatography test. This will tell you MLF is completed and you should rack again and treat with Meta. DO a search on MLF and secondary fermentation before you do anything else.

 

[wyntheef]

dave,
actually, the term 'secondary fermentation' does not normally refer to a malolactic fermentation.

flafemina,
there are threads here regarding malolactic fermentation that you can refer to, but unless mentioned in your instructions,
you shouldn't need to be concerned with it. imo it will only further complicate what you are already struggling with.

 

[Thig]

Secondary fermentation is a misnomer that is used often incorrectly. When you transfer from the primary fermentation bucket to the carboy it is a continuation of the same fermentation process. It is often called the secondary fermentation because it is placed in the second container. From what I understand, unless you are doing an MLF there is only one fermentation from start to finish.

 

[shoelesst]

You said Secondary Fermentation which is MaloLActic Fermentation (MLF). Thisis the process that can take from a few weeks to a few months. You can check the SG all you want and it should be 1.000 or less from the point you put it in your carboy and put an air lock on it. If you rack and treat with Meta prior to the completion of MLF, your wine will never develop fully and be unstable. You need to get and MLF quick test or better yet a paper chromatography test. This will tell you MLF is completed and you should rack again and treat with Meta. DO a search on MLF and secondary fermentation before you do anything else.

This was my question as well. Some refer to MLF as secondary fermentation and some refer to secondary fermentation as the finishing of fermentation in the carboy or second vessel. I didn't read if they were adding a malolactic bacteria so I am assuming they mean just finishing then alcohol fermentation. If that's the case and in the case of MLF as well, once the wine stops producing gas and you have checked that you are dry, the wine becomes susceptible to spoilage and that is the time to sulfite. If it's just the alcohol fermentation you are referring to, it will never take six months and will be much closer to 7-14 days depending on temps, yeast and possibly nutrients.

If you are putting the wine through MLF and that's what the secondary fermentation is referring to, then several months is possible, again with variables being temps, bacteria, pH, nutrients, acid level, luck....

My best guess is that they were referring to alcohol fermentation only in which case I would sulfite as soon as you confirm dryness and CO2 production is over.

Please let us know if MLF is in the equation.

Enjoy.

 

[dave1117]

once wine finishes primary fermentation, and an airlock is applied thus eliminating the introduction of oxygen malic acid can be converted to a much less bitter and acidic lactic acid. This happend by bacteria. Seeding with bacteria can help the process speed up, but it will hapen one way or the other since malic acid in the abscence of O2 will convert. I do not know that this process can be avoided...I make my wine from grapes and this process needs to take place. Please educate me. Is juice different? While you criticized my comment you did not offer an answer to his question. In my wine making, we crush and primary takes place in our large vats, we press and secondary, namely MLF takes place in our carboys for approximately 75 days at 75 degrees. Then we go to oak barrels. As I am always a student of this exciting hobby, please teach me!

 

[Flafemina]

I am referring to a continuation of ferm. I just went from an open bucket to glass carboy with air lock. The SG was at 1 3 days ago. My concern is spoilage and when should I add Meta. My instruction are just very vague because its from juice and I think the merchant uses the same sheet for all varieties he sells. I am on day 8.

 

[shoelesst]

once wine finishes primary fermentation, and an airlock is applied thus eliminating the introduction of oxygen malic acid can be converted to a much less bitter and acidic lactic acid. This happend by bacteria. Seeding with bacteria can help the process speed up, but it will hapen one way or the other since malic acid in the abscence of O2 will convert. I do not know that this process can be avoided...I make my wine from grapes and this process needs to take place. Please educate me. Is juice different? While you criticized my comment you did not offer an answer to his question. In my wine making, we crush and primary takes place in our large vats, we press and secondary, namely MLF takes place in our carboys for approximately 75 days at 75 degrees. Then we go to oak barrels. As I am always a student of this exciting hobby, please teach me!

MLF will not automatically happen in the absence of O2. I does need a bacteria. In red wines it does often happen naturally because the native bacteria that lives on the skins. Since whites don't sit on skins, they almost always have to be inoculated. MLF is very sensitive to sulfites, so sulfiting is one way to prevent, although for most reds, going through it improves the taste as you say, less bitter.

As I suspected that the nest ructions the original poster was talking were just about alcohol,fermentation, so I would just wait until you are dry and bubble free, then sulfite.