quick question secondary ferm.

[guitar309]

ok.. so last night my hydrometer read 1.020 it dropped about .040 in 24 hours it seemed like... so I went ahead and transferred to secondary since the mosti kit says to transfer around 1.050 to 1.040 .... so last night at about 8 it read 1.020.. I transferred to secondary and now its reading 1.002 but if I leave the hydrometer in the wine for a min. or 2 it will rise to about 1.010 anyway it says when it gets to around .996 to proceed to the next step.. and it says this will usually be 10 to 12 days.... well at the rate its going it could be in a day or 2!!??? whenever I get the same reading for a few days in a row right...??

so my problem here is it seems to be going way 2 fast and its only going to end up being in the secondary for like 3 or 4 days!!?? maybe I am just freaking out.. but it just seems like its not going to take anywhere near 10 to 12 days.. whats wrong???

 

[Rocky_Top]

No worries,
let it do it's thing. No hurry, It will be ok for many weeks to come. I allways let it set for two weeks even iftheSGis the same for over a week. some times things just move faster. You can still rack if the sg stays the same for three days, I am just not in that big of a hurry myself.

 

[Rocky_Top]

Are you testing the sg in a test tube or wine thief. If so it sounds like the hydromiter is touching the sides. I have to roll the wine thief around untill the hydromiter stops moving up or down.

 

[Tom]

With new winemakers they have a tendency to over think the process. If I remember you have a KIT. That being said FOLLOW DIRECTIONS that came with it. Timing may be off a little. That's why you take readings. Best to use a wine thief and a tall tube to put the wine & hydrometer in. When doing that make sure the bubbles are gone and thehydrometer is not touching the side.

 

[Wade E]

Make sure to spin the hydrometer as you are putting it in to shake off the C02 that will want to keep it afloat higher. Once it has been sitting in the wine for a minute the fermentation process builds up pressure under a still object and gives it a lift. Dont worry about the difference in time as kits almost always go faster then instructed but you can wait the allotted amount of time anyway once its in the carboy. You did the right thing by getting it in glass and I dont like the MM instructions about transferring at an SG of 1.040 as there is an extreme amount of fermentation still going on and at that point you will have to split it into 2 carboys or deal with wine coming out of your airlock.

 

[Mark]

After 2 AllJuices that volcanoed when racking at 1.050-1.040 (the first because I didn't know any better, the second happened even though I was trying to be careful), for my third AllJuice I racked 3/4 gallon to a 1 gallon jug and the rest to the carboy. That left plenty of room for both to outgas without overflowing, then I racked the jug back to the carboy 2 days later to finish fermenting. Everything went fine and I didn't lose a drop. I'll do it that way from now on.

 

[Tom]

Mark
I would rack around 1.010-1.020 that way most of the fermentation is over thus reducing volcano's leaving the "sludge" behind

 

[Mark]

I actually asked George about that a while back and he said that Mosti thinks racking at 1.040 infuses some oxygen just when the yeast need it to help prevent a stuck fermentation. But so far all of my fermentations (WE and MM, 6 kits total) have been healthy and completed to dry so waiting until 1.020 should be fine. Guess I'll have to try that next time.

 

[Wade E]

I would rack to 6.5 gallon carboy at the recommended if i had 1 but otherwise its a PITA. I just give it a good stir in primary with mix stir at 1.040 and that does the same thing and then rack at 1.015 myself.

 

[Mark]

The instructions say to add the oak to a carboy and rack at 1.050-1.040, then rack again when fermentation finishes 6-7 days later. I know to go by SG and not time, but waiting to rack until 1.02 doesn't leave it on oak that many days before fermentation is done. Waiting 6-7 days after the 1.02 point to extract all the oak would leave the wine in contact with alot of dead yeast for a few extra days. Is that OK?

 

[Tom]

I add oak when aging after you take the wine off the yeast. That way you can kep it under oak for months. What was the gravity when you racked it?



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[grapeman]

Mark If you want to reclaim the oak and add it to the secondary, as long as it is cubes or big chips, pour the lees in a collander after transfering to the secondary. Rinse all the dead yeast off the chips through the collander and then add back into the secondary. Of course if it is oak powder, you won't recover it, but that extracts fully in just a few days becasue of the much greater surface area.

 

[Mark]

I'm refering to the oak chips that come with MM AllJuices intended to get fully extracted in the 6-7 days it generally takes between racking to glass and the end of secondary fermentation. It would just be alot easier to leave in a few extra days. How long can a wine that's just completed secondary fermentation sit on the dead yeast before it starts picking up off flavors?

 

[grapeman]

You can leave it in there for a few weeks with no problems. If there is a ton of lees, it can start to decompose and create off flavors. I have never had an off flavor from a kit with lees for up to two months myself.


I did an experiment this fall with real grapes. I left a gallon jug full of a grape wine sitting on 3 inches of lees for three months. That did cause an off flavor in the wine. I racked off at that point and transferred to a couple smaller bottles. I will let it clear and age and see if the off flavor persists or goes away with time.


My point is that you should rarely need to worry about extended time on the lees as long as it isn't for a really long time. A few days isn't a problem.

 

[Mark]

That's plenty of margin so next time I'll just wait till 1.02 and then leave it on the oak for at least 7 days after that (even if fermentation is done)before racking. Thanks (as always!)

 

[PeterZ]

Look up the battonage for "buttery chard" in other threads on this forum. This technique has you leaving the chardonnay on the lees for a month, stirring a couple of times a week. It improves the mouth feel of the wine. Most of my wines spend at least an extra week on the lees before racking off.

 

[Mark]

I knew it was OK after the second racking (just after fermentation completes to get the wine off all that yeast), but I wasn't sure about between the first and second racking (which is when MM has you use the oak they provide) because that's also when the lees contain the most yeast. But it sounds like a few extra days on that dead yeast won't hurt anything.