Pear Wine

[Ernest T Bass]

I have 40 lbs of frozen pears that are thawing now, they have been peeled, cored and sliced thin. I would like to make some real good wine (for a change). I have read some recipes but still have questions. Should I add pear juice purchased at the grocery (if I can find it) to make 5 gallons or should I thaw more pears (I have about 50 more lbs frozen). If I don't add pear juice to get the 5 gallons, I don't know how much must I will have, so I don't know how much of each chemical to add. From what I have read, the lower the fermenting temperature, the more flavor you get. What yeast should I use (if this is true). I would like to start the must at a SpGr of 1.075 to keep from hiding the flavor with alcohol, I have a temperature controlled cabinet, so I can control the fermenting temperature in the winter. Is there any advantage to adding the k-meta and waiting 24 hours before adjusting the SpGr and adjusting the pH and waiting 12 to 24 hours before adding the pectic enzyme and other chemicals then wait another 24 hours before pitching the yeast. What yeast should I use and how low of a temperature can I ferment at???????????
Thanks for any help
Semper Fi
Bud

 

[Arne]

Howdy Bud,
I started a pear this fall. First try at it. I scrounged enough pears to get 5 gal. of juice. Did not freeze the pears first, just ran them thru the apple grinder, then put em thru the apple press. Did all the ususal things, k-meta, pectic, nutrient, energizer, some tannin, can't remember, but maybe some acid too. Anyway, its been sitting for a couple of months now, doesn't look like it has cleared a lick although it has dropped a bunch of lees so has to of cleared some. I would make sure I k-meta'd it, wait and add pectic. Should help it clear. Think I would press the pears after they thaw and see how much juice you get. I believe you can get most of the juice out by putting them in a strainer bag and applying pressure. If you don't put too many in, you can probably get by with a board on top and a bunch of weight. Mite just try it with a few first and make sure it works. If it doesn't work, you are only out a bit of time. I would put 8 oz. or so of lemon juice in with it to keep it from browning. I used lavalin 74 yeast and the basement was about 65 degrees or so. it took a couple of days, but it took off in the cool temps. It fermented down, but instead of a few days it took a couple of weeks to finish. If you try pressing them, let us know how much juice you got from them. Seems like it took a heck of a lot more pounds than that for me, but I didn't freeze them first. Good luck with it, keep asking if you have probs. Arne.

 

[Turock]

OK Bud---here's how we make pear. We make it every year and it turns out real well:

You should use 10# per gallon. When you get this fruit into a vat to thaw, it's gonna take 2 to 3 days to thaw. The best way to protect it is to layer in meta as you toss the frozen fruit in. Along with the meta, layer in pectic enzyme so you start breaking down the fruit. Enough meta(but not excessive) is especially important if you use 71B culture, which I'll explain later.

When the fruit has totally thawed and warmed up to room temp (you can go in and stir it so it thaws and warms faster) start taking PH readings. You'll have a TON of juice and will find no need for other pear juices. Adjust your PH to 3.35 to 3.4 You'll notice you have quite a bit of fruit browning---don't be concerned about that as it doesn't affect the flavor or the color of the wine later on. We like an ABV of 12-12.5% Don't get the alcohol too high--you aren't making fire-water here. You can allow the room temp to go up to 72 degrees, or so--but you want a cool ferment on this to retain volatiles.

I think the best culture for pear is 71B because it metabolizes some of the malic and makes the wine nice and smooth. Pear done with other cultures that don't handle the malic as well will work, but pear made with no water dilution can be kind of harsh until it's aged to the 2 year mark. So if you use 71B, you'll have a nice smooth wine in a year.

71B has some extra requirements because it is sensitive to wild flora and other yeasts. This is why I said to use enough meta in the fruit so you knock down the wild flora and keep the must from fermenting on its own. A winery can have much resident yeast in it if you've been making wine a lot of years. You don't want these residents to start a ferment because the 71B will have too much competition. Be sure to use go-ferm and fermaid K with 71B, as they are more complex nutrients and fermaid K always needs go-ferm along with it. Be sure to rehydrate it before pitching.

Also, you'll do yourself a big favor to bentonite the primary. Then you won't have the clearing problems that plague a big, pulpy fruit like pears. Be sure to rack when needed, because you always have to rack a couple times more with bentonite additions. Be sure to follow the directions on the bentonite package--don't use more than recommended---be sure to hydrate it, and not just throw it in dry. Don't be shocked when you transfer from the primary--the wine will look like milk because of the bentonite. Let it age at least one year in the carboy and you'll have the best pear ever. At bottling, we take some and add cinnamon extract, that we make, to it. Cinnamon pear is a nice autumn drink for us. Good luck. Any other questions--let us know.

 

[Dend78]

here is what i did, http://www.winemakingtalk.com/forum/f45/pear-34180/, its clearing nicely, its no where near as fast as a dragons blood but its not doing bad at all. flavor is still questionable but from other users that's normal as it takes a long time to come into itself, like a year plus. this was my first attempt at pear as well.

 

[Tom_S]

The first time I made pear wine, I used a corer/peeler that worked OK, but was very time consuming and messy. The second time I just let the pears ripen until somewhat soft, then quartered them and just threw them into the press. I didn't notice any difference in taste with the skins left on.

 

[Ernest T Bass]

Stuck?

Turock, I used your recipe and everything went good, till now. I think it's stuck.
What I have done:
50 lbs of frozen pears, sliced thin, cored and pealed
added 5 tsp Pectic Enzyme and 1/2 tsp of K-Meta
added 2 qts of great value, 100% apple juice-not from concentrate, ( I know you said that I would not need it, but I already had it and thought this would be a good place to get rid of it)
Two days later:
pH = 3.7 - added 6 1/2 tsp of acid blend (all I had)
got more acid blend and added 12 or 15 more tsp, so many I lost count, but that much only lowered pH to 3.6. Don't feel good adding more.
added 3/4 tsp of tannin (wild guess as to how much to add)
added 2 1/2 tsp of bentonite
added 2 1/2 tsp bentonite to 6 oz of boiling water
and stirred like crazy until it was all dissolved.
let it set for 10 minutes
added to must
added 5 tsp yeast nutrient
SpGr = 1.050
added 4 cups of sugar syrup
SpGr = 1.080
added 2 1/2 tsp enigizer
Rehydrated yeast = Lalvin 71B 1122
Next day = SpGr=1.020 = must temp 82*
Next day = SpGr= 1.020
Today, added 2 tsp yeast nutrient
Yes, I have a new pH meter and calibrated it just before testing must, both times.
Need Help, what should I do? Thinking about adding some 1118 to must?
Thanks
Semper Fi

 

[Ernest T Bass]

forgot to mention

If it is of any help, my must looks like thich brown gravy with lumps in it.
Semper Fi

 

[Turock]

OK---The thing about 71B is that it's a little fussy on nutrients. The Scott Labs book of yeast will tell you to be sure to use Go-Ferm along with Fermaid K, instead of using just regular yeast nutrient. You put in 1/2 the dose of these at the start, then the other 1/2 when 1/3 of the sugar has been used up--so if you start with a 23 brix on the must, the other half goes in at around 16 brix or so. I've never used 71B without the fermaid and go-ferm so not sure how it behaves without it. And by the way--all of these need rehydration along with the 71B.

Speaking of rehydration--there are some parameters here. The rehydration temp should not be more than 18 degrees different between IT and the must temp. And once you have yeast rehydrated, the yeast population declines if you let it sit for more than 30 minutes before adding to the must.

Why is the must 82 degrees? That's too hot for a white wine--you lose the volatiles. We like a temp of 72-75 degrees for whites. You'd think with a must temp that high that the yeast would be working just fine. But my intuition is that your problem stems from not using the complex nutrients of Go-ferm and Fermaid K with the 71B culture.

By the way--are you punching this down daily? The must needs oxygen at this point, and that could slow down the ferment.

The problem now is, what should you do. I would tell you to rehydrate some more 71B, but not sure that will work without the nutrients. I suppose you could go ahead and pitch some 1118 because that will take off for sure. You won't get the benefit of the 71B, but you'll still have a nice pear wine. Don't worry about that color! Our must was very brown too---that's how pears are, even with enough meta. It never seems to impact flavor or the color of the wine.

I think you were wise to stop adding acid. We've had the same thing happen to us a couple times---adding acid and no PH change. But the ending PH came out close to what we wanted. If it seems a little flabby to you when you go to bottle, you could add a tiny bit of acid blend to it. We'll see when you get it to that point.

Hope I've answered your questions. Next time you use 71B----BE SURE to use Fermaid K and Go-ferm with it. It's an excellent yeast for malic acid management.

 

[Ernest T Bass]

82*

Bad judgement on my part, I had no heat on the temperature box (converted gas grill with strip heater, fan and temperature control switch) when I put the must in it. I added the pectic enzyme and K-Meta and let it work for a couple of days. I figured the temperature would drop to room temperature, but it didn't. I punched the must down and stirred it probably 3 or 4 times a day, but it did all this fermenting in just a couple of days. I think I'll try the 1118 and if that doesn't do it I'll order other type of nutrient.
This brings up another question, can I end up with too much yeast in my must or will any excess yeast be racked off and not left in my wine??
Thanks
Semper Fi
Bud

 

[Turock]

The yeast will only be able to use whatever food (sugar) is available to them. After that point, the wine should be dry--0.099 Some people co-ferment with a couple different yeasts.

When you have frozen fruit, it takes a LONG time for it to come up to room temp and that's why you have to be sure to use a proper amount of meta in it. Our vat of 100 pounds of pears took 3 days to thaw--then we bagged it, got into the primary, and waited a couple more days to pitch the yeast because it STILL was not up to room temp. So I understand your being a little afraid about must sitting around this long. But we've been doing this for 23 years and have experience in handling a big volume of frozen fruit and knowing about it not spoiling before we get the ferment going.

Actually my best intuition on this is you should try some 1118 in it. The only reason we use 71B is because pear is a little harsh because of the malic acid. 71B metabolizes up to 20% of the malic and the resulting wine is MUCH smoother and not harsh. However, other yeasts work perfectly fine on pear but you'll find it may need up to 2 years of aging before it smoothes out. Some people don't mind the harsh flavor--depends on what you like. Another little trick to reduce harshness is to add a little glycerin to it before bottling. Glycerin helps to wipe out some of the harshness. We can talk about that later, depending on how this ends up. You can ask me about it then if you need to use it.

I hope you will try 71B again when you ferment malic fruit--you'll like the result once you understand how to manage this fussy culture. Be sure to have it all on hand before you start.

It would really help you if you got your hands on a Scott Labs yeast catalog. We all need to educate ourselves about the cultures we use so we understand how to provide the best environment for them in our musts. I always study on things before doing them. I'm sure you could get one if you got in touch with Scott Labs. We got ours from a winery owner that we know, but I've heard of other people who have these catalogs---it would even be worth it to BUY one. Good luck Bud--let me know if I can help you further.

 

[Ernest T Bass]

scottlabsltd.com

I'm at a loss for words to show my appreciation to everyone for their help and concern with my problems. I would have given up long ago without your help. I search Scott Labs, I found everything you would ever want to know everything on a pdf. Go to scottlabsltd.com and click on the fermentation hand book, everything is their, now if I can just understand it.
Thanks so much to everyone
Semper Fi
Bud

 

[Turock]

Studying that book will help you to understand things a bit better---THAT and continuing to make wine. You have to practice this art to understand it.

There's even a whole page in that book on SO2 management. It's a good book--we refer to it often. Check out the enzymes they sell for making reds--these are supposed to be better than pectic enzyme, and some give off nice spice notes.

So did you pitch the 1118 and is it fermenting now?

 

[Ernest T Bass]

Yeast

I pitched the yeast, I didn't have any 1118 at home and the LBS is 20 miles away, so I had some 1116 and pitched it. Going in town today and will get some 1118, should I pitch it also?
Here is what I have done since I determined it was stuck:
26th - added 2 tsp of nutrient
27th - added 4 tsp of nutrient
added 2 tsp of enigizer
added K1-1116 (hydrated)
28th - SpGr still 1.020 - no change, but I did see where there may have been some
activity, the cap had some places that looked like some bubbles had burst,
only 3 or 4 places.
Question: Can I add too much Yeast or Nutrient or Energizer? Will these settle out and be racked off, will they leave a taste in the wine?
Thanks for all the help
Semper Fi
Bud

 

[Turock]

You can't add TOO much yeast---but you CAN add too much nutrient. Don't add more nutrient once you pass the 50% dry mark.

Was this yeast fresh? When storing yeast, put it in the freezer. Be sure the temp is 72-75 degrees and don't forget to stir. Are you stirring?

 

[Ernest T Bass]

Pear

The yeast was freshly bought, didn't check the date on it. Stirring 3 or 4 times a day and temp is about 78*. The must is soo thick and soupy, would it help if I strained all the must thru a paint strainer to get rid of all the pulp? That would give me a much cleaner sample to check the SpGr.
Thanks for all the help
Semper Fi

 

[Ernest T Bass]

Pear

Ran the must thru a paint strainer, ended up with 4 1/2 gallons of must. Checked SpGr ofter straining and it is still 1.020. I'll give it a couple of days and if it doesn't drop I think I'll add some 1118. What do you think?
Thanks
Semper Fi

 

[Turock]

From here---it's hard to know exactly what the problem is. Whenever you have a problematic ferment, it's best to try to find the cause and address IT---otherwise you're just "parts changing." But there is no doubt that this ferment has some kind of hostile condition.

Just how much meta did you use in the vat pre-ferment? We use 1 campden tab per gallon--and in a large vat of thawing fruit, we like to layer it in instead of just tossing it in on top. Maybe there is too much SO2 in the must, creating a bad environment for the yeast to take hold. In that case, 1118 might work as it's SO2 tolerant.

Your must shouldn't be soupy--sounds like you didn't use quite enough pectic enzyme in it.

It's too bad this isn't working for you--we do it this way all the time and have good success with it. Seems there is some kind of technique error going on here, and without being there with you to see what went on, it's difficult to diagnose.

As a side note-----I was at my buddy's winery yesterday and he gave me his old 2011 Scott fermentation handbook. I was comparing it to the 2006 handbook he gave us years ago. The new one says not to use go-ferm and fermaid K together. The 2006 book said to use them together with 71B culture. I really hate when this sort of thing happens. We rely on these labs to have done all the entological work and we sort of take them as GOSPEL. Then they tell us later--oopps, don't do that. Very frustrating!!

It's too bad you don't have some go-ferm. It's also recommended for a stuck ferment. But you also added 1116, which is also a good yeast for stuck ferment.

 

[Turock]

By the way, I would try to get the must temp down to 72-75 degrees. 78 is a little hot for a pear wine. You should do "cool" ferments on whites. Cool ferments are 72-75 degrees.

 

[Ernest T Bass]

Pear Problems

Again, thanks for your time and interest in my problem
.
I added 1/2 tsp of K-Meta in the must and layered as best as I could. They were frozen in 1 gallon freezer bags
Added 5 tsp of pectic enzyme
Went in town yesterday and got some 1118 and added a pack last nite.
go-ferm or fermaid K = Which should I use? I really don't know what I'm talking about (go-ferm/fermaid K) What do they replace or do, I figure they must replace Nutrient and enigizer???

Also, a friend gave me some liquid pectic solution, it looks very old, here is what is on the label: Crosby & Baker - Pectic Enzyme Solution - Usage 1/4 tsp per 5 gallons -1/2 fl oz - 7370A -
Grape and Granary - Pectic Liquid - 1/2 oz WA51 =$2.59. It looks like it's too old to use, but I have read that some of the chemical never get too old????
Thanks
Semper Fi
Bud

 

[Turock]

Oh good--you got some go-ferm and fermaid K. I'm going to give you instructions on this right out of the Scott Labs fermentation handbook.:

This is the general instructions for a stuck ferment. They have specifics on making a restart for lower brix stuck ferments but your brix is still pretty high. So here it is:

Go-ferm is rich in mictonutrients so it will add biomass. But when residual sugar levels are high, as in your ferment,an addition of Fermaid K directly to the stuck wine is recommended. Spoilage organisms can compete for nutrients (actually sounds like you didn't use enough So2 at the start,Bud--this might be part of your problem) and this inhibits yeast growth. Adding lysozyme to the stuck wine prior to restarting the fermentation may also help control the unwanted bacteria and provide a cleaner environment for the new yeast culture. However Bud--if you bentonited the primary, you don't want to use lysozyme with it because bentonite inhibits the lysozyme. Adding yeast hulls or Nutrient Vit End to the stuck wine prior to restarting the ferment may help reduce accumulated toxins and improve the chances for a successful restart.

So be sure you hydrate the go ferm and fermaid K------it seems like you have a lot of yeast in this wine. Do you think you need to add more to it???? The problem seems like it might be nutrient related----maybe you got some bacterial competition going--I know 71B doesn't like that!!!! So the bacteria is competing too much with the yeast for nutrient. Get the nutrients in there-- the fermaid and go-ferm---they have minerals, Vit B, folic acid in them. It just MIGHT get the ferment going very strong.