MV Chard Kit - 6 Mo's - No nose, little to no flavor?

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we5inelgr

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Hi all,

The details:

Master Vintner Limited Edition 2016: Philosophie Chardonnay
Purchased from Northern Brewer in Dec 2017.

Yeast that came with kit: Lalvin ICV-D47
Yeast that I substituted for: Lalvin CY3079

French Medium toast cubes used during primary.

Bentonite used at the start, per instructions.

Final SG: 0.998

Been in a glass carboy since Feb 19 of this year, at 62-64 F consistently, with no oak after fermentation.

Just sampled the wine.

It has no nose, and there is really no flavor to it. Can't quite describe it other than simply being neutral. The wine is a little on the...what I'll call, "thick" side, very similar to some CA Chard's in terms of viscosity.

I substituted the yeast because I was trying to get some of the descriptors from CY3079 - fresh butter, toasted bread, honey, hazelnut.

My wife and I find none of that, actually nothing really at all in terms of flavors or aroma. I'm making other wine from kits, and from fresh grapes, and they all have aroma's and flavors as I would expect.

What could be wrong here? Was it a major mistake substituting for that specific yeast? Maybe this kit needs to be oaked in the carboy? I didn't recall that from the instructions, just wondering.
 

Johnd

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Hi all,

The details:

Master Vintner Limited Edition 2016: Philosophie Chardonnay
Purchased from Northern Brewer in Dec 2017.

Yeast that came with kit: Lalvin ICV-D47
Yeast that I substituted for: Lalvin CY3079

French Medium toast cubes used during primary.

Bentonite used at the start, per instructions.

Final SG: 0.998

Been in a glass carboy since Feb 19 of this year, at 62-64 F consistently, with no oak after fermentation.

Just sampled the wine.

It has no nose, and there is really no flavor to it. Can't quite describe it other than simply being neutral. The wine is a little on the...what I'll call, "thick" side, very similar to some CA Chard's in terms of viscosity.

I substituted the yeast because I was trying to get some of the descriptors from CY3079 - fresh butter, toasted bread, honey, hazelnut.

My wife and I find none of that, actually nothing really at all in terms of flavors or aroma. I'm making other wine from kits, and from fresh grapes, and they all have aroma's and flavors as I would expect.

What could be wrong here? Was it a major mistake substituting for that specific yeast? Maybe this kit needs to be oaked in the carboy? I didn't recall that from the instructions, just wondering.
I’ve never done that particular kit, but have done others, and recently did a Chard from grapes using CY3079. I fermented at 55 F (to preserve delicate aromas and flavors) and put the wine through MLF (not an option on a kit) and was super pleased with the results.
In my experience, kits have a very light to nonexistent nose for some time, and the better kits can take a while to develop their flavor profile. My advice is to continue to care for your wine in the carboy, oak if you like, but give it some more time before you get discouraged.
 

salcoco

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I would check the ph and acid. low acid wine can be neutral. i would take a sample and use some tartaric acid sprinkling some in the sample like you would be salting food and see if there is any change. if so I would perform bench trials to find a optimum dosage.
 

Brian55

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Used the D-47 and bulk aged it on a bit of oak. I was thoroughly underwhelmed at bottling. I'm hoping it was just a phase it was going through. It's been a month or so, time to open a bottle to see if there's any improvement.
 

geek

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I made this same kit earlier this year and it’s been in carboy bulk aging after it cleared , time to rack and take a sip.
 

we5inelgr

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I would check the ph and acid. low acid wine can be neutral. i would take a sample and use some tartaric acid sprinkling some in the sample like you would be salting food and see if there is any change. if so I would perform bench trials to find a optimum dosage.
Just checked the numbers, they are as follows:

TA = 4.8 g/L
pH = 3.24

So it looks like my TA is too low. I'll add tartaric acid till I'm at 7 or slightly above. Thanks!
 

Brian55

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Ours has improved significantly. I'm going to assume it was bottle shock.
 

Johnd

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Just checked the numbers, they are as follows:

TA = 4.8 g/L
pH = 3.24

So it looks like my TA is too low. I'll add tartaric acid till I'm at 7 or slightly above. Thanks!
The buttery, toasty, bready notes you’re looking for out of your CY 3079 are typically enhanced through the process of MLF and sur lie aging / stirring, and generally yielding a wine with a higher pH than you have right now. Adding 2.2 g/L of tartaric is going to drive your pH down and make your wine more sharp and tart, and that’s the opposite of the mellow, smooth flavors you are attempting to achieve. Do a small sample before adjusting the whole batch.
 

WinoDave

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I made this kit exactly to the instructions, taste great and took 2nd place at state fair.
 

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