Fruit Packs Values

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hounddawg

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ok first off most of my questions cause comotian, that is not my intent,
i see fruit pack,s seem to be very popular,,,, i've been on here since 2014, but learned from the old timers clean back into my early teens, 59 now,, hence my unorthodox style,
i see many winemakers both traditional and country wines, f-pac's to me are for ease of use, i have never made or used one, each and every country wine i make i put my fruits or berries straight into my must, i stir using a dewalt 18 volt cordless and a food grade mixer that kraft industries use in their plants, i stir each and every day, so by the time i start my rack from ferment barrel to carboy my must is in a fine mush state,,, and yes tons of work separating my wine for my cake, now this is just my opinion only, but i believe doing it my old timers hill folks ways, i believe it gives me a richer color, aroma, and flavor, again 5 times the work but the entire thing about wine is to strive for your best,, yes?,, and even though i will not change my ways, i am always willing to learn your ways, your styles, your train of thought, so any feedback good, bad, nutreruail is very welcome by me, yes i am set in my ways, but i believe a closed mind is mush, i wish to learn, over thousands of years there has been more ways and styles than can be counted,
Dawg
 

Johnd

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Well @hounddawg , it’s certain that you’ve been able to learn and adopt at least a few new ways, after all, I’m sure the old timers who taught you back in the day weren’t using 18V Cordless Dewalt Drills to stir their must, they were probably using young hounddawgs, I’d suspect................ LOL!!
Having made fpacks, I too prefer the fruit flavor from the fermented fresh fruit over the cooked fruit, but that’s just me.....
 

hounddawg

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Well @hounddawg , it’s certain that you’ve been able to learn and adopt at least a few new ways, after all, I’m sure the old timers who taught you back in the day weren’t using 18V Cordless Dewalt Drills to stir their must, they were probably using young hounddawgs, I’d suspect................ LOL!!
Having made fpacks, I too prefer the fruit flavor from the fermented fresh fruit over the cooked fruit, but that’s just me.....
yup; back then you had a short cut garden hose to rack with, and yes sir ,i've tried hard to get the work outta wine making,,, lol
 

Rice_Guy

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If the method works then do it. ,, wine is a preservative system. The fruit pulp is edible and when we get down to it, it’s only a cosmetic issue. I try to produce perfectly clear for contest samples, but if it isn’t for contest why bother?

We in this culture are used to tossing bruised apples, bread with mold, left overs that are a week old, two year old instant rice that never got sold (the only issue is our packaging fades under fluorescent lights). Our average is 17% of income gets spent on food, Europe is about 25%, some African countries are 50%. Industry in the states is selling convenience today, we recognize that we won’t sell more food calories so we sell more packaging.
I am the child of someone who lived through the depression so I have screwy food values (at least to my wife who thinks cooking is reheating something formulated in a factory)
 
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hounddawg

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If the method works then do it. ,, wine is a preservative system. The fruit pulp is edible and when we get down to it, it’s only a cosmetic issue. I try to produce perfectly clear for contest samples, but if it isn’t for contest why bother?

We in this culture are used to tossing bruised apples, bread with mold, left overs that are a week old, two year old instant rice that never got sold (the only issue is our packaging fades under fluorescent lights). Our average is 17% of income gets spent on food, Europe is about 25%, some African countries are 50%. Industry in the states is selling convenience today, we recognize that we won’t sell more food calories so we sell more packaging.
I am the child of someone who lived through the depression so I have screwy food values (at least to my wife who thinks cooking is reheating something formulated in a factory)
yup, my dad was born in a barn with snow blowing through the cracks of the barn walls, in january, i raise a garden, my beef, my pork, eggs, but i'm twisted, i give my cake to the chickens, it messes with egg production, but gawd to watch a hen fly up and hit the roost pole head first just kills me,.,,,, um i didn't tell that out loud did i ?
Dawg
 

hounddawg

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If the method works then do it. ,, wine is a preservative system. The fruit pulp is edible and when we get down to it, it’s only a cosmetic issue. I try to produce perfectly clear for contest samples, but if it isn’t for contest why bother?

We in this culture are used to tossing bruised apples, bread with mold, left overs that are a week old, two year old instant rice that never got sold (the only issue is our packaging fades under fluorescent lights). Our average is 17% of income gets spent on food, Europe is about 25%, some African countries are 75%. Industry in the states is selling convenience today, we recognize that we won’t sell more food calories so we sell more packaging.
I am the child of someone who lived through the depression so I have screwy food values (at least to my wife who thinks cooking is reheating something formulated in a factory)
i do hate to admit that i want my wine polished as clean as the come, after some reflection it must be ego on my part,
Dawg
 

1d10t

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We all evolve a system that works for us. If it suits your taste then it is right for you. By all means try new things that you think might improve on your method.
 

hounddawg

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We all evolve a system that works for us. If it suits your taste then it is right for you. By all means try new things that you think might improve on your method.
i have my set ways kinda,, lol,,, but in everything if your not learning you're wasting your mind, and yes i have evolved in many ways, but first besides my wines, i am addicted to trying new things, oh i have my fav's, but well a empty carboy is a sin,, lol, and i am very interested in how others go about their craft, everybody has their own quirks,,own methoulds, own reasoning, so my point is that i am not looking to improve my style, i'm very happy with what i make for myself,,, , but i like knowing how and why of others, and i have about 10 wines i make my way, but at least once a year i like to splice others ways and types together and make a surprise carboy, just for shits and grins, i at no point ever claimed to be right in the head, my only goal in life is to live it learning,,,
Dawg
 

Scooter68

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like the comment about folks tossing bruised apples. When we get apples from out trees, NOBODY would put them in a fruit bowl on their table for display. I don't use bug sprays and have had no success with keeping away birds and even the #@&*@# Squirrels. So - they aren't pretty - but I usually get enough to make some decent apple wine and cider and a few for the wife and I to eat. Sadly, the squirrel population is going to be less this year as I have now adopted a shoot-on-site approach regardless of where ever I spot them on the place. (Sorry animal lovers - they stripped my trees last year and we got maybe a couple of dozen apples from 3 trees that were loaded before we went on vacation for 10 days.
 

Johnd

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i do hate to admit that i want my wine polished as clean as the come, after some reflection it must be ego on my part,
Dawg
For me, it’s perfect clarity is beautiful, artistic, and pays homage to dedication and devotion of all of the great winemakers who’ve come and gone. To produce and bottle a cloudy wine, for me, would be failure.
 

BernardSmith

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The best wine you make is the wine that you and everyone you share it with enjoys. We are not making wines for some unknown customers whose tastes tomorrow are unknowable today. We are essentially making wine for ourselves. And we know what we like and we know what we are trying to achieve.
 

hounddawg

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The best wine you make is the wine that you and everyone you share it with enjoys. We are not making wines for some unknown customers whose tastes tomorrow are unknowable today. We are essentially making wine for ourselves. And we know what we like and we know what we are trying to achieve.
wiser words have I never heard, your articulation is dead on right,
 

hounddawg

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like the comment about folks tossing bruised apples. When we get apples from out trees, NOBODY would put them in a fruit bowl on their table for display. I don't use bug sprays and have had no success with keeping away birds and even the #@&*@# Squirrels. So - they aren't pretty - but I usually get enough to make some decent apple wine and cider and a few for the wife and I to eat. Sadly, the squirrel population is going to be less this year as I have now adopted a shoot-on-site approach regardless of where ever I spot them on the place. (Sorry animal lovers - they stripped my trees last year and we got maybe a couple of dozen apples from 3 trees that were loaded before we went on vacation for 10 days.
scooter68 how do you really feel about them bushy tailed rats hum,,, lol ,, sorry i just could not resist, them little satanic Devils tear me up on my pear tree and my pecan tree,,,, if iI HAD claymores they'd be hanging all over my trees,,,
Dawg
 

Rice_Guy

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,,, but in everything if your not learning you're wasting your mind, and yes i have evolved in many ways, but first besides my wines, i am addicted to trying new things, . . . but i like knowing how and why of others, . . .
* OK back to post no 1:
most fruit runs through the freezer, it is either pressed and juice is fermented or it goes to the primary and sits five days with periodic stirring. The reason for freezing is 1) I am collecting produce and buying time for when it is convenient, 2) freezing breaks cell walls and helps with juice release, 3) heat solubilizes pectin, I am trying to minimize the level of pectin I have to deal with, 4) making fruit wines I am looking for a trait in one crop to blend with another crop as elderberry (mid summer) gets mixed with Concord grape (fall), 5) in the food plant roughly half the ingredients were purchased as 40 pound or 50 pound frozen boxes so I am used to it. ,,,, The reason for pressing: I have a home built press and I can be lazy, mom was more active hanging a bag of pulp off the kitchen cabinet and squeezing by hand into a crockery bowl ,,,,, memories there

I would not break the pulp down since I like fairly clear wine, however some things like watermelon just drop out so the only impact is blinding the nylon filter bag which makes it harder to get the juice/wine separated. Paper filters blind faster than the nylon bag. ,,, (also like to build toys so I ought to use them)

Did I just say most things get a filtering treatment? Yup.
 
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hounddawg

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* OK back to post no 1:
most fruit runs through the freezer, it is either pressed and juice is fermented or it goes to the primary and sits five days with periodic stirring. The reason for freezing is 1) I am collecting produce and buying time for when it is convenient, 2) freezing breaks cell walls and helps with juice release, 3) heat solubilizes pectin, I am trying to minimize the level of pectin I have to deal with, 4) making fruit wines I am looking for a trait in one crop to blend with another crop as elderberry (mid summer) gets mixed with Concord grape (fall), 5) in the food plant roughly half the ingredients were purchased as 40 pound or 50 pound frozen boxes so I am used to it. ,,,, The reason for pressing: I have a home built press and I can be lazy, mom was more active hanging a bag of pulp off the kitchen cabinet and squeezing by hand into a crockery bowl ,,,,, memories there

I would not break the pulp down since I like fairly clear wine, however some things like watermelon just drop out so the only impact is blinding the nylon filter bag which makes it harder to get the juice/wine separated. Paper filters blind faster than the nylon bag. ,,, (also like to build toys so I ought to use them)

Did I just say most things get a filtering treatment? Yup.
if your going to blend then elderberry and blackberry,,, apple and pear,,, as for fruit pack all my country wines, always get busted down to mush and always with patience are crystal clear, f-pack just cut down the work, but just my 2 cents also reduce the flavor, albeit just some, but i strive for all the flavor there is, breaking down pulp has zero effect on clearness except the amount of work put in to clarification, so that being said if my wine was not worth the extra effort then i would just buy other peoples wines, wine is only the work and love put into it, Period.
Dawg
,
 

akron

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Not sure if this is the right place to ask this question. Do F-packs in kits have sulphite or sorbate in them? (are they fermentable?)
 

cmason1957

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Not sure if this is the right place to ask this question. Do F-packs in kits have sulphite or sorbate in them? (are they fermentable?)
Some people have added them all or partially into the mix early on in the fermentation process, so best guess is no they don't. I would not suggest adding much more than half prior to fermentation, for many of the kits, the primary taste comes from that fpack.
 
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