Another Fermentation Question

[mikefrommichigan]

I started my third kit, a Vintners Reserve Mezza Luna Red on Feb 1. The Brix/OG reading was 21/1.087. The fermentation started approx 24 hrs later on Feb 2 and the temperature of the must was 70 degrees.

I checked the fermentation (made sure that the airlock was releasing CO2) and temperature daily.

So I checked the wine this morning and the airlock was still bubbling approximately every minute or so. I took a Brix/SG reading of 7.2/1.029 and the temp was 70 degrees.

I was not surprised that the wine was still fermenting, but I was surprised that the reading was only 7.2/1.029. (Not sure what I expected). According to the kit instructions I should keep on fermenting and take daily readings until the SG is at or below 1.010.

My question is, what if in another 5 -7 days it has still not reached the SG of 1.010? Is it better to leave the wine in my fermenting bucket until it reaches an approx SG of 1.010 or rack it off the lees now into a carboy and let it continue fermenting in the carboy, and then maybe rack again when the fermenting has stopped?

Thanks again for everyone’s help on this forum.

 

[novalou]

Next time you take a Brix reading, give your must a stir.

Give it another day or two, then regardless of the SG, transfer to your carboy.


Sent from my iPhone using Wine Making

 

[cmason1957]

Since it is under an airlock, it makes absolutely no difference if it is in your bucket or in a carboy. I think if it were me, I would check the SG every day and give it a really good stir. Those yeast will get going faster that way.

Some will suggest you take the lid off. I believe just stirring will be fine.

 

[mikefrommichigan]

Thanks, I will give the mixture a good stir when I check the readings again tomorrow. Is an occasional stir during fermentation something that you do all the time, or just when the fermentation is taking longer than expected?

 

[jamesngalveston]

cmason is correct....if me i would remove the lid, and let it have fun.
just cover with a cloth, etc.....yeast loves oxygen as much as sugar and starves without it.

 

[cmason1957]

I ferment open top most of the time. The exception for me is when I am doing a white grape wine. They tend to oxidize fairly easily, so I go under air lock early. But no matter what, I stir twice or three times a day. It keeps the yeast suspended and if there is any fruit in the must, it keeps it wet. Then I real to secondary at about 1.010 or lower.

I have only had one wine out of about sixty stop short of 0.996 doing it this way.

 

[mikefrommichigan]

What happens at racking time, if you stir every day? Do you wait 24 hours or so before racking to allow the sediment to settle?

 

[sour_grapes]

What happens at racking time, if you stir every day? Do you wait 24 hours or so before racking to allow the sediment to settle?

That is what I do.

 

[cmason1957]

I don't worry about it in the least at that first racking. I think getting all the possible crud you can at that point is a good thing. It keeps that fermentation going strong.

There is plenty of time for clearing later. I suppose I should say, since my first kit, I have never bottled on the day the instructions day to. Time is a good thing.

 

[jamesngalveston]

I ferment to dry on all but my mustang grape, then i do as mason says.

I don't worry about it in the least at that first racking. I think getting all the possible crud you can at that point is a good thing. It keeps that fermentation going strong.

 

[Pumpkinman]

I would not remove the lid at this point, if fermentation is slowing down, the wine is producing less CO2, the CO2 is what will protect the wine during fermentation.
Your wine has been fermenting for just over a week, there is nothing to worry about, use your hydrometer to monitor the fermentation.
If you decide to stir the wine, you really just want to stir the yeast back into suspension at this point, and gently introduce oxygen, don't stir it so hard that you introduce so much oxygen that you promote oxidation.
If you rack the wine off the yeast/sediment too soon it can stop fermenting all together, I'm a firm believer of letting the wine ferment to dry before transferring to a carboy.
What type of yeast did you use, and did you hydrate it before pitching the yeast?
Did you use any yeast nutrients? (It's too late to add any at this point)
Airlock activity is not an indication that fermentation is complete, or active for that matter.

 

[mikefrommichigan]

Tom – I used the yeast that came with the kit, it was a Red Star, Premier Cuvee, Active Dry Wine Yeast. I did not hydrate the yeast, just sprinkled it on. The kit did come with a nutrient pack, so I did not add any.

I gave it a stir this afternoon, and took a Brix reading, it had dropped slightly since yesterday morning, so it is still fermenting slowly.

Is it advisable to add yeast nutrients with a wine kit?

Still learning a lot and a lot to learn, in this great new hobby.

 

[Pumpkinman]

Mike,
I use yeast nutrients such as Fermaid K and/or Fermaid O to all of my wine, even the few kits that I have made.
It s always advised to hydrate the yeast before you pitch it, the good folks at Lalvin say:

Dry yeast needs to be reconstituted in a gentle way. During rehydration the cell membrane undergoes changes which can be lethal to yeast. In order to reconstitute the yeast as gently as possible (and minimize/avoid any damage) yeast producers developed specific rehydration procedures. Although most dry wine yeast will work if pitched directly, it is recommended to follow the rehydration instructions to insure the optimum performance of the yeast.

And this from Jack Keller:

Lallemand's scientists found that some musts and juices contain sprays, toxins and excessive SO2 that can be detrimental to the activity of yeast. The dry yeast is like a sponge for the first few seconds in liquid and will absorb everything into the cell that it would normally reject in the rehydrated form. Many home winemakers add the ADY culture directly to the must or juice and get away with it. However, many times it is the beginning of a sluggish or stuck fermentation. There are over 150 billion yeast cells in a 5-gram packet of Lallemand yeast. If you kill off half of them by improper rehydration, you still have 75 billion cells to work with. This 75 billion will go on to do a good job most of the time, but whatever killed off the other 75 billion may have seriously affected the health of the survivors. Can you spell "stuck fermentation?" A little prudence is good insurance.

The bottom line is this, you can get away with sprinkling dry yeast into the must, but you stand a good chance of killing up to 50% of the yeast, and have a negative impact on the other 50%.
Slow fermenting is still better than no fermentation at all, keep us posted and ask as many questions as you can, we are always glad to help!

 

[mikefrommichigan]

When you say hydrate, do you mean make a yeast starter. I do this when I make beer, but my starter is usually active for 12 – 24 hours before pitching.

 

[Pumpkinman]

Mike,
Good to know that you are a home brewer!

With dry yeast, we don't make a yeast starter like we make for brewing beer, this is done within 15-20 mins instead of 24-48 hrs.
We simply heat water to 110° -115° and add the yeast, after 5-10 mins or so you should see some foaming activity on the surface, at this point, I take some of the must, an amount equal to the water you are hydrating the yeast in, and make sure that is isn't more than a 20° difference in temp (if so, I'll gently warm it), and add it to the hydrated yeast, this will give it the "food" it needs to continue to multiply and reproduce creating a large "colony" of yeast cells.

This is optional, but Highly recommended:
I will normally start by adding Go-ferm, a yeast hydration nutrient, to the water heated to approx 120°, when the temp drops to 110° -115°, I'll add the yeast as posted above.
I add the yeast nutrient Fermaid O and Fermaid K split into two or three applications, the first being just after I pitch the yeast, I'll use Fermaid O because it contains an organic for of Nitrogen, You can add the Fermaid O to your must before pitching the Go-ferm & hydrated yeast as its not toxic to young yeast babies like DAP, Fermaid K contains DAP which is perfectly fine once the yeast is established.
I hope that this makes sense.

The biggest difference between Making Beer and Making wine is that with beer, everything happens so fast you have to always to be thinking about how every action that we take is going to effect you now, with wine making, you will be testing, adjusting, tweaking, aging it to some degree over the course of 12 months to over two years, you have to think about how the actions that you are taking now may not only effect your wine now, but months and even years from now.
Lots of fun!

Tom

 

[mikefrommichigan]

Thanks Tom, it all makes sense. I will be making a yeast starter now for my next wine later this month.

 

[Pumpkinman]

No probs Mike.

 

[mikefrommichigan]

Since my last post 3 days ago I have stirred the wine every evening and taken a reading. The SG has dropped slightly, but it is still only 1.028, so I am a little bit concerned as to what to do now. The temperature is hovering about the 70deg mark.

I guess I have several alternatives.

1) Pitch some more yeast into the fermenting bucket – If I did this I would re-hydrate the yeast and follow pumpkinman’s advice and mix in some Go-Ferm and yeast nutrients. or
2) Rack to a carboy and hope it continues to ferment. or
3) Rack to a carboy and pitch some more yeast, as 1 above.

Any other suggestions are very welcome.

 

[Pumpkinman]

Don't rack it off the yeast, I'd try the following:
First, I'd try a 1/4 tsp of Fermaid K to see if that'll kick it off.
If that doesn't work, I'd probably get a packet of EC-1118, hydrate the yeast with go-ferm, and pitch it.

 

[mikefrommichigan]

Racked over to carboy today without having to add Goferm or more yeast. SG was 1.005. I think all is well.
Starting a new thread about refractometers.