Home made vacuum system not working

[sampvt]

I made a perfectly good vacuum pump system using a powerful vacuum pump that is connected to a carboy fitted with a dual hole bung. The second carboy with the wine in it has a tube going through a bottle for overspill and when switched on the carboy with the wine is transferred into the vacuumed carboy in a pretty quick time.

It mirrors the vacuum pump u tube using a purpose built expensive set up. There are no seals or bungs leaking and after 10 passes, the wine is still not degassed. I used the sheet rack principle where the incoming wine goes down the side of the carboy.

Everything is as it should be but alas, its not degasing the wine. All the wine being transferred into a vacuumed carboy so no contact with the air and its foaming up like a good un.

What the hell has gone wrong.

 

[sour_grapes]

I pull a vacuum straight onto a half-filled carboy (i.e., with no transferring going on). I then agitate the wine by shaking the carboy. This releases the CO2 very expeditiously.

 

[sampvt]

I pull a vacuum straight onto a half-filled carboy (i.e., with no transferring going on). I then agitate the wine by shaking the carboy. This releases the CO2 very expeditiously.

Paul

I value your input as an accomplished wine buff, however please correct me if I am wrong, but I am understanding that the way you degass, is to simply transfer half of your wine to a separate carboy and shake the life out of it.

Obviously the same action would happen to the other half which will leave you with 2 x halves degassed by a shaking motion only.

No vacuums, no drills, no allinonepump type transferring and no other chemical or mechanical devises employed, just pure brute strength and years of experience.

In closing, I have just emptied half my carboy and gave it a shake with my hand over the end and when I released my hand, I got no escaping gas, I was just left with a mixture with a 5 inch creamy foam head. Presumably my system did work but is the foamy head just air bubbles or is it not co2 gas.

Hopefuly you can steer me in the right direction please.

 

[sour_grapes]

No, you misunderstood a bit. I do transfer half, like you described, but then I pull a vacuum on this half-filled carboy using a vacuum pump. I then shake it while it is under vacuum.

 

[sampvt]

No, you misunderstood a bit. I do transfer half, like you described, but then I pull a vacuum on this half-filled carboy using a vacuum pump. I then shake it while it is under vacuum.

Now I understand and that makes sense, all the degassing is done under a vacuum so the mix cant take on air and presumably the vacuum pump is then left on the carboy to remove the agitated air bubble out and through the pump.

I can do that as my vacuum pump has these bungs with a non return valve in.

 

[NorCal]

I have a homemade vaccuum set up as well, I vacuum transferred and filtered the recent batch of Skeeter carboy 4 times and it did a good job of degassing. Did you use starsan? I suspect you are seeing foam vs. released CO2 as you noted.

 

[sampvt]

I have a homemade vaccuum set up as well, I vacuum transferred and filtered the recent batch of Skeeter carboy 4 times and it did a good job of degassing. Did you use starsan? I suspect you are seeing foam vs. released CO2 as you noted.

I have no idea what starsan is and foam is bubbles so how can we tell if these bubbles/foam are co2 or air.

 

[NorCal]

Starsan is a sanitizer that tends to foam a lot. Give the wine a taste and see if it is flat.

 

[richmke]

The foam could be CO2 coming out of solution. Or, it can merely be from the agitation of going into a new carboy.

There are two properties you need to look at in a pump:
1) How much vacuum it can create.
2) How fast it can move air.

You want a pump that can create 20 mm Hg of vacuum.

I'm guessing that you want a pump that can move at least 5 liters per minute while under vacuum. 6 gallon carboy in about 5 minutes.

If you don't have that volume, the pump will not be able to keep up with the in-flowing wine, and thus your mm Hg will drop.

 

[sampvt]

The foam could be CO2 coming out of solution. Or, it can merely be from the agitation of going into a new carboy.

There are two properties you need to look at in a pump:
1) How much vacuum it can create.
2) How fast it can move air.

You want a pump that can create 20 mm Hg of vacuum.

I'm guessing that you want a pump that can move at least 5 liters per minute while under vacuum. 6 gallon carboy in about 5 minutes.

If you don't have that volume, the pump will not be able to keep up with the in-flowing wine, and thus your mm Hg will drop.

My pump is a .9 bar which I believe is slightly more than 25mm hg. It probably transfers a 5 gallon in around 5 mins, but it keeps up well.

When I switch it on I wait for 1 or 2 mins so the vacuum builds up, then I open the valve and let it flow. After it starts flowing, I just let it run but occasionally turn the valve off, just to let the pressure build up and then open the valve again.

I am pretty sure I am doing it right according to all the u tube videos and the allinonepump video as well.

now its time to get all the proper bungs and correct tubing but where to get them is a different question, I feel daft going to the guy that does the allinonepump thing. if he was in the uk I wouldn't need to have made one.

 

[vacuumpumpman]

Rich
I agree that you should have around 22 in hg of vacuum and between 20-25 LPM of flow.

sampvt
I do ship to the UK and it really is not that expensive - especially the accessories that can fit in a padded envelope.
If you would like a price quote please go on my accessory page and pick out the items you are needing and I can give you a quote.

I was able to calculate .9 bar = 26.58 in hg of vacuum - I would make sure that you install a regulator on that .

Yes you might be just getting the wine agitated rather than removing CO2 - always try the poof test - Put some wine in a test tube or bottle and hold thumb over top and shake and place near ear and let go of your thumb and listen for a release of CO2.

 

[cimbaliw]

Wine de gasses most effectively around 22c (72f). Regardless 10 passes should pull all of the CO2 out. You might try simply splashing the wine into itself during racking. Four passes should be more than enough. Fear not wine will eventually degas itself. One last thought, is the wine done fermenting?

 

[JimmyT]

Before I got my allinonewinepump I thought about doing a homemade setup. In my research on pumps I think I read somewhere that you have to watch getting a pump that pulls to much vacuum because it could actually start to boil off the alcohol. I wonder since your pump pulls more than the allinone if your lowering the boiling point under vacuum to the point where this is the case and the bubbles you see creating the foam is just the wine boiling. Just a thought, I'm trying to think what else it could be because usually after about the 3rd rack on any wine it's usually degassed fully. That includes a wine that just went through ferment and is no more than a month old.