Other Finer Wine Kits new process white wines

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So Matteo, I'm just curious but if someone skips using the C / K clarifiers, would it just take a very long time to clear naturally? Or would it never clear if you skipped using them?
 
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I’ll add my two cents. I have only made one white wine in my not long history of making wine. White wines are new to me, but I’ve been making the FWK reds for awhile and have confidence in FWK. I bought the Riesling after Matteo released them a few weeks ago. And with knowledge that there was a coloring issue in the past which, I feel assured isn’t there anymore. I have trust that these wines will look and taste great. If my comments lead anyone to suggest I’m unhappy or feel something is wrong, their wrong. I want to understand the new (to me) clearing process.

For anyone waiting to see or hear about our experiences before buying, that’s fine and we all learn together (those of us newer winemakers). Again, I trust these wines will turn out great as Matteo has stated, and I’m really curious to watch the clearing steps. I mean really, a black liquid clearing and evolving to a nice white/golden wine is cool. Science!
 

Matteo_Lahm

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So Matteo, I'm just curious but if someone skips using the C / K clarifiers, would it just take a very long time to clear naturally? Or would it never clear if you skipped using them?
[/QUOTE

Quite honestly, I’m not sure. We didn’t test them without using the clarifiers. It would stand to reason that it would eventually clear but it would take a more time. I would definitely not skip that step because you want to clear it out as quickly as possible.
 

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I’ll add my two cents. I have only made one white wine in my not long history of making wine. White wines are new to me, but I’ve been making the FWK reds for awhile and have confidence in FWK. I bought the Riesling after Matteo released them a few weeks ago. And with knowledge that there was a coloring issue in the past which, I feel assured isn’t there anymore. I have trust that these wines will look and taste great. If my comments lead anyone to suggest I’m unhappy or feel something is wrong, their wrong. I want to understand the new (to me) clearing process.

For anyone waiting to see or hear about our experiences before buying, that’s fine and we all learn together (those of us newer winemakers). Again, I trust these wines will turn out great as Matteo has stated, and I’m really curious to watch the clearing steps. I mean really, a black liquid clearing and evolving to a nice white/golden wine is cool. Science!

we are all taking home winemaking geekery to another level. This is just an example of the weird science that goes on behind the scenes in the wine industry.
 

Matteo_Lahm

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I’ve added a third advisory to the instructions for the whites. It says that these kits employ advanced clarifying techniques. Failure to follow the instructions exactly can impact the results and the final product.

Without question, whites are more difficult because they are clear. The color and clarity are just as important as the taste and while this is also true with reds, they are a lot more forgiving. Whites have a much smaller margin of error.
 

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I’ll add my two cents. I have only made one white wine in my not long history of making wine. White wines are new to me, but I’ve been making the FWK reds for a while and have confidence in FWK. I bought the Riesling after Matteo released them a few weeks ago. And with knowledge that there was a coloring issue in the past which, I feel assured isn’t there anymore. I have trust that these wines will look and taste great. If my comments lead anyone to suggest I’m unhappy or feel something is wrong, their wrong. I want to understand the new (to me) clearing process.

For anyone waiting to see or hear about our experiences before buying, that’s fine and we all learn together (those of us newer winemakers). Again, I trust these wines will turn out great as Matteo has stated, and I’m really curious to watch the clearing steps. I mean really, a black liquid clearing and evolving to a nice white/golden wine is cool. Science!
Mike, how is the Riesling progressing?
 
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Mike, how is the Riesling progressing?

Riesling is progressing nicely, Rocky. I'm a week behind you. My fermentation bucket is sealed up tight and I'll rack off the gross lees and into a carboy next Tuesday eve. Right now, my bubbler is still bubbling...but slowly. Everything proceeding as it should. Thanks.
 

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Riesling is progressing nicely, Rocky. I'm a week behind you. My fermentation bucket is sealed up tight and I'll rack off the gross lees and into a carboy next Tuesday eve. Right now, my bubbler is still bubbling...but slowly. Everything proceeding as it should. Thanks.

Good to hear. I assume you cannot see the wine and have no idea of the color at this point.

I just checked my Muscat and, although the wine is slowly losing the black color, it is clearing (that is, translucent) to a yellow/gray, if that makes any sense. I will be very interested in what you find when you remove the cover from your Riesling. To me, and I could be completely mistaken, the implication in the original directions is that all the charcoal will be settled out, taken down by the bentonite. I will be pleasantly surprised if you find this the case.
 

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Are you suggesting that we by-pass degassing and the addition of Packet D, add the Kieselsol and Chitosan and then degas and stabilize?

I just realized I misread your question. Add the fining agents first. You can degas and stabilize later. I would give the clarifying agents two weeks and then transfer. After transferring, then you can degas and stabilize. It would be better to do it this way because you don’t want to stir the wine and kick up any sediment.
 

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So I was just reviewing the instructions. We are still advising customers to do degassing stabilizing and clarifying during the same step however, if you did not degas BEFORE adding the clarifying agents which is what the instructions specify, wait 14 days and rack it again. After getting the wine off the clarifying sediment, then you can proceed to degassing and stabilizing. The point is to not vigorously stir the wine after the clarifying agents have started to clear it. No point in kicking up all that sediment.
 

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I’m doing the FW Chardonnay kit and have followed the directions with the kit before reading all this. Just last night I degassed, stabilized, and added the fining agents. Attaching a photo of my wine at the start, right before racking and stabilizing, and the next day after. There is a big difference in color just over night.
 

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I’m doing the FW Chardonnay kit and have followed the directions with the kit before reading all this. Just last night I degassed, stabilized, and added the fining agents. Attaching a photo of my wine at the start, right before racking and stabilizing, and the next day after.
👍appears to be clearing nicely, thanks for sharing.
 

Rocky

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I’m doing the FW Chardonnay kit and have followed the directions with the kit before reading all this. Just last night I degassed, stabilized, and added the fining agents. Attaching a photo of my wine at the start, right before racking and stabilizing, and the next day after. There is a big difference in color just over night.
Thank you for the update. Can you clarify whether or not you added the Kieselsol and Chitosan into the Big Mouth or into the carboy? Does the "clarified" wine at the top of the carboy have a gray hue? Can you show a shot of the sediment in the bottom of the carboy?

I am a little bit ahead of you process-wise with a batch of Muscat and mine is about what you show in the third picture but about halfway down the carboy. The wine is clearing, that is it is becoming translucent, but it has a gray hue. From your third picture, you appear to have the same condition. Also, I am getting a great deal of sediment.

Thanks.
 

Matteo_Lahm

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I’m doing the FW Chardonnay kit and have followed the directions with the kit before reading all this. Just last night I degassed, stabilized, and added the fining agents. Attaching a photo of my wine at the start, right before racking and stabilizing, and the next day after. There is a big difference in color just over night.

looking good! Wait to you see you in a few days and it will not have a gray hue. As for the sediment, it will be the same amount left behind in a standard clearing process. The bulk is just the fining agents. The amount of carbon that was added is very small and those particles bond when they drop out. As I have continued to say, you are using professional techniques.

as you guys all know by our instructions, we don’t just tell you how to make wine kits, we teach how to make wine. We don’t just explain what to do, we tell you why and how. We know that some of our kit customers will go on to start making wine from fresh grapes. It’s an evitable evolution that some will be compelled to follow. That said, we set out to produce kits that were good enough quality where people can make a commercial grade wine without all the equipment investment and labor required to work from fresh grapes. When we developed the carbon technique for the whites, we knew some people would be freaked out by the juice turning black however, it was necessary to get the required standard of results. While there is a lot of romance in winemaking, it’s also chemistry. Those who master the craft understand that it takes both.
 

Kross

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The Kieselsol and Chitosan were added to the carboy after racking out of the Big Mouth. Just over night there seems to be a big change and lots of the carbon is on the bottom of the carboy.
 

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