2 new batches - same problem on both

[space]

So I just started two new batches...

Blackberry
1.09 SG
3.39 PH
Free SO2 38 ppm
TA 3.1 ppt

Everything looks good, tastes great, acid is low. I added enough to the batch to get the TA to 5.3 ppt, resulting in my PH dropping to 3.01.


Blueberry
1.085 SG
2.97 PH
Free SO2 41 ppm
TA 1.6 ppt

Everything looks good except the PH and TA. Added enough to get the TA to 3.4.

So...with both batches either the TA or the PH, or both, was off. I chose to adjust the TA over the PH, resulting in unfavorable PH levels. So the question is... how can both the PH and TA be low on the blueberry? That doesn't make sense. I calibrated all of my equipment yesterday so that shouldn't be a factor.

 

[Wade E]

Fruit wines are tricky to get into a true goal range as they are either very high or low to begin with. What acid did you use to adjust these wines as Tartaric acid will lower a PH much more then Citric or malic will. Are you using a good digital PH scale and how did you calibrate it? Please elaborate on the method of calibrating. What were the PH and TA #'s before fermentation.

 

[space]

Wade, that was the PH and TA's prior to fermentation. The PH of the blueberry dropped to 2.65 after increasing the TA. I started fermentation just a little bit ago. I'm using a digital PH meter calibrated yesterday with 4.01 and 7.01 solution. I'm using a minititrator for TA which I calibrated yesterday as well. I used acid blend for adjustments.
Edited by: space

 

[Wade E]

I question the accuracy of that meter as it doesnt make sense that they are both low like that. I would try calibrating again to see if you get the same readings. Here is a little info to try to get it to a more acceptable level.
<h2> Acid types and pH </h2>
Within the usual pH range of wine, tartaric acid is more highly ionized
than malic, which is in turn more so than citric. Tartaric will liberate
the most H⁺
ions yielding a greater shift in pH. Thus, adjusting TA with tartaric
causes a larger shift in pH than an equivalent quantity (same TA shift)
using malic or citric being added. For maximum pH adjustment with a
minimum accompanying TA increase, use tartaric.

If all is the same just know that as fermentation progresses the acid will drop thus raising the PH into a more acceptable level.

 

[grapeman]

It wouldn't hurt to check the meter again, but it is probably right. Those numbers seem about right for those crops. The blueberry pH is a bit low now, but it probably took quite a bit of acid blend to get the acid TA higher.

 

[space]

Thanks Wade and Appleman. Yes, it did take quite a bit of acid blend to get to 3.4 TA. So as it ferments, the PH will increase and TA will decrease. Should I adjust it to 6.5-7.0 TA after fermentation is complete, dropping the PH again? The TA already seems low to me but I didn't want to affect the PH anymore.

 

[grapeman]

I don't think any further adjustments would be required or prudent at this point. If it is just plan flabby when done, then maybe a bit of acid, but I wouldn't worry about it unless the pH is way off target.

 

[First250]

I plan to start my very first fruit wine this weekend. One gallon of blueberry and maybe one blackberry.


What are my chances of making a decent wine by just following established recipes (as on this website) and not investing in the pH test eqpt. etc., adjusting pH, and TA??Thanks

 

[grapeman]

Your chances are great that they will turn out just fine without the expensive test equipment. Sometimes it will turn out better for beginners because they don't make mistakes in their readings being new to the equipment. If they get wrong readings, they can add way too much of something increasing their chances of less than desired results. The blackberry will be a bit harder, but if perfectly doable. Good luck with it.

 

[First250]

Thanks. Blueberry bushes were loaded this year! First year that I got enough to make wine with, eat, and give away to friends.


I used recently frozen ones for this 1 GL batch. After mixing and waiting 24 hours to add the yeast, fermentation startedin just 13 hours (@ basement temp of 75-76 degrees F)Starting SG was 1.095, a bit higher that I saw was recommended. Maybe because I added raisins. In any case itsmelled and tasted great this morning! Great color. Wish I didn't have to wait a year. This weekend I'llstart a gallonwith frozen blackberries .






As always, thanks for the advice and encouragement!

Edited by: First250

 

[space]

Well, the first batch of blackberry I made is doing great. It is really dry now. I've transferred to secondary. Still some activity there, but has died down over the last day. SG was @ 1.01 prior to transfer, Free SO2 @ 8 ppm, TA at 6.5, PH down to 3.04 (IIRC). Should I wait until the first racking to up the SO2 since I'll be using k-meta anyway?

 

[Wade E]

Wait until the wine is stable(same SG for 3 consecutive days) before adding any k-meta.

 

[space]

Thanks.