Vacdegassing: Spinoff has anyone imploded a carboy

[rshosted]

I ask this becuase I am curious at how many bars of pressure an empty carboy can handle vs. a full one?

I am planning on going to a store today to buy a vacuum pump (probably manual). I have not had *ANY* luck in my drill stir technique. I seem to always have a little gas in my wine. So I figure it's time to try something else.
I also have a 6.5 gallon carboy that I got years and years ago, that was used by my older brother (years and years ago). Today, I noticed it has a hairline crack in the bottom. It almost looked like a construction flaw it's so small. It hold liquid and does not leak.

Theoretically I could still use it for wine. Or I could fill it up with water and try to implode it to see what the tolerances are

I figure if it handles up to whatever the pump takes, I can try it empty for Sh*** and gigles.

I also think it has a few things that are inherantly going to make it 'weaker' than a fresh carboy. One- its age. two- the hairline crack in the bottom (though that is the thickest part). Three- the higher altitude I am at (about 4500ft.). four- the temperature outside (since it's below freezing yet again

)

Any suggestions on this little experiment? I will probably put the carboy in a heavy duty clear garbage bag prior to the 'experiment'.

 

[masta]

Ryan,
A quick search through the archives and I found this info which should help.



From jobe05:
If I may steal a phrase from Waldo:


Whaaaaaaaaaaaa Whoooooooooooooooo


Boy did I have a brainstorm of an idea.


Take 1 -11 year old, and your wife's vacume bag sealer and what do ya get!

An extreme DeGassing Machine!


About 5 seconds after this picture was taken, the friggen bottle imploded

Luckily, it gave out right on the bottom rim, very evenly so it only leaked a little, then I slid it to the edge of the table and back into the bucket that I had just cleaned...... Now have back in a bottle..........


The good thing...... It's de-gassed!


The bad thing....... I know have Joe's Orange mead on my ceiling, and muscadine all over the kitchen floor........ Cranberry wine is next......... I wonder what my kitchen will end up tasting like in a year!

Dean posted this:
25" of mercury (hg) is well within tolerance of standard carboys. The recycled 1 gallon jugs that everyone uses may not be the same strength/thickness of glass that most carboys use. Tim V. when he uses his vacuum keeps his at 25" of hg and goes for lunch while it is under pressure. I've kept many of my carboys at 25" or as close as I could get it for hours at a time. I've not done that to 1 gallon jugs because they are light enough for me to pick them up and shake the heck out of them, which does just as good a job at degassing as the vacuum does. I think that someone did a test on a carboy and found that it was about 450" of hg before they would implode when full. Just remember to have enough liquid in the carboy at least to the shoulders before you start to vacuum so that the liquid inside can resist the pressure. Also check your carboy for weak spots, and small cracks. If you can detect any, don't vacuum it!


Again,I would not do this for 1 gal jugs, but actual carboys that are 2 gal or higher with thick glass!Edited by: masta

 

[rshosted]

Thanks Masta, saved me a big mess and time spent cleaning....

Now, here is my next question:
I have one of those bag sealers too. I was thinking of using it. Does anyone have any idea of what type of vacuum they can create? I doubt I would ever use it on a 1 gal bottle after reading about waldos experience, but I've used it hundreds of times on 750ML bottles and splits without a problem.

I wonder if it gets enough vacuum to degas a 5-6.5 gal carboy?

Maybe I shouldn't buy a manual vacuum if I have the bag sealer one already.....

Has anyone used on of these on a 5 gallon carboy? If so, how did you adapt the fitting to work?

Thanks in advance,
-R

 

[PeterZ]

My biggest question is what would happen if the wine foams up and runs up the tube to the vacuum bagger? Will that ruin the bagger?

Carboys do not implode, they are crushed by air pressure. Remember that light bulbs have vacuum inside, and are resisting the same air pressure.

 

[masta]

Not sure of the amount of vacuum the bag sealer will create but I would be very careful and adding a in-line gauge might prevent a very huge mess.

Pulling a vacuum on a non-rated vessel such as a carboy is risky and would use caution especially if you can't measure it.I have seen large s/s tanks and 20,000 gallon rail cars crushed like a tin can by pulling vacuum on them.

 

[Funky Fish]

Martina has modified a vacuum bag sealer in the past, I believe.


I'd think you just watch the foam level and turn it on/off as the foam rises/falls.

 

[sangwitch]

i received the latest copy of wine maker magazine today and there's an article in there about this topic. "Operating in a Vacuum. Alternate degassing for wine kits."

 

[rshosted]

Thought I would post this for ya'lls intertainment. I asked FoodSaver about my FoodSaver vacuum packer:


Dear Mr. Shosted,


Thank you for contacting Jarden Consumer Solutions.


We appreciate your interest in our FoodSaver products.


FoodSaver appliances pull a vacuum equal to 24 inches of Mercury at sea level (24Hg = 0.813 bar).


You state in your email that you wish to preserve using a 5-gallon
jug. It is important to remember that vacuum packaging does not
replace refrigeration or freezing of perishable items.


If you need further assistance, please don't hesitate to contact us
through our toll free number, 1-800-777-5452. Our hours are 8 am - 8
pm Monday through Friday, and 9 am - 6 pm Saturday, Eastern Time.


Sincerely,


Ann Savacool

Jarden Consumer Solutions</font>


Though, my brother is a handy experimenting kind of guy. He was using his FoodSaver for something else and had reason to measure the vacuum with a vacuum guage he had. He said he only pulled about 15 inches....

Now I'm not sure if it would hit the 25's I was hoping for or if he is correct. I have to assume he is right for my altitude maybe???? And FS is at a perfect altitude and weather conditions in a 'perfect' environment.

 

[Wade E]

Used the mighty vac for the first time, awesome and so easy.Here is the
Cherry getting degassed. The first one is just hooked up. The 2nd one
is under vac.

 

[jobe05]

Wade, I'm glad you got one and tried it. I love mine and use it all the time, on every batch. Even during the clearing stage, I think it help, beause the bubbles arn't there to kkep things suspended. I also use it when I bottle. You'd be surprised of how much more air/co2 will come out of the wine in each bottle.


(PS: On the 750ML bottles, I take it to 27HG)

 

[Wade E]

I bought it from your reccomendations Jobe! Thanks!
Edited by: wade

 

[rshosted]

Can someone post a pic of thier mighty vac and what they cost normally?
Thanks,
Ryan

 

[jobe05]

Ryan:


Here a picture of one that is on ebay right now for $44.95 (plus shipping).

you won't need the bottle and other stuff shown, but it comes with the pump. I did different searches on Ebay when I got mine (miss spelled words, Brake bleeder, break bleeder, mighty Vac etc.....) Got mine for $24 from someone who couldn't spell.......... Wait........ I can't spell..............


I would recommend the metal one, and it's rebuildable. I think Wades is a plastic one but is not rebuildable. Mine is about a year old and is starting to lose some of it's pressure holding abilities.Edited by: jobe05

 

[Wade E]

Yes it is the plastic one.All you need is the bleeder pump(big thing),
one hose shown coiled up, and the biggest fitting shown on the bottom
left.

 

[jsmahoney]

That looks complicated!

How exactly does this work? I see the pictures of wade and the one in progress. Is it complicated? I'm interested in this and would like to learn more. Any down to earth class or explanation? PeterZ if you see thisplease, refrain from calculation comment!

 

[Wade E]

Its very simple.

1) Attach hose supplied with tool and biggest fitting supplied with tool to gun like in picture 1.

2) Then attach fitting into bung hole and I mean the one on top of your carboy.

Pic 2

 

[Wade E]

3) Pump until you reach about 18 on the gauge and wait a second as the
bubbles will start surfacing fast. You can gradualy take it up to 25 on
the gauge. I reccomend not going any higher as this is what Ive read on
this forum. Pic. 3 you can see the bubbles being pulled up. I just
leave it on and pump it back up to 25 every once inawhile . I started
yesterday and its almost done right now!

 

[jsmahoney]

Thanks Wade! I can do that!

A picture is worth a thousand words! That helps me a lot! Thanks!

Edited by: jsmahoney

 

[jobe05]

Wade:


When you get the opportunity, try it on a wine that is clearing, see if it clears faster for you. Also do it a bottling, on each bottle after it's filled. I did 30 bottles of Washington-Columbia Valley Reisling today that has been sitting for over 2 months, with weekly vacumes being pulled on it. Friday night I pulled 25HG and let it set for 24 hours, didn't drop a bit. At bottling I was amazed at how much more came out.

 

[Wade E]

Will do Jobe! My Cherry is still going but it is also very cold down
there. 60* in my basement and thats why I had to get brewbelts today
now that the cold weather has really set in here now!