Tweaking a kit

[mumptia]

I often read about "tweaking" a kit with raisins, wood chips or fruit.
I'm leary of adding something other than what the kit supplied simply because I'm worried about the fermentation.
For example, if I add some fruit or raisins, I up the sugar content in the primary and the sg as well. At what point is the sg to high for the amount of yeast?

 

[Thig]

I often read about "tweaking" a kit with raisins, wood chips or fruit.
I'm leary of adding something other than what the kit supplied simply because I'm worried about the fermentation.
For example, if I add some fruit or raisins, I up the sugar content in the primary and the sg as well. At what point is the sg to high for the amount of yeast?

I don't think it would be the amount of yeast as much as the strain. Some can handle a higher alcohol than others. That being said, I don't believe most people would start any higher than about 1.100 or maybe 1.120, and that might even be a little high.

 

[cimbaliw]

I encourage you to read all of the "Good Wines Gone Bad" threads by joeswine. They are awesome. Raisins in the secondary will give you tons of body but remember to balance with tannins as Joe suggests. You may want to do the math, rack your 6 gal batch to a five gal and try the tweak with the remaining wine in a separate gallon carboy. If you like you can go back and tweak the five'r

 

[mumptia]

Sounds good. I'll give them a read.

 

[LoneStarLori]

The tweaking as done by Joeswine is done after primary fermentation and before stabilizing. I am working on a tweak using his recommendations and I can tell you there is a big difference in the way it tasted before and after the raisins. It is much fuller and really smoothed out the bite.
If you would like to see how thare are done with pictures, the one I am doing is posted here:
http://www.winemakingtalk.com/forum/f61/almond-wine-9155/index22.html#post448821

Joeswine original posts start here:
http://www.winemakingtalk.com/forum/f6/when-good-wines-g-ne-bad-29481/index31.html#post410608

 

[mumptia]

Cool, thanks.

I'm still in rookie stage (on my 5th kit ) and so far I've been pleased with all of them.

Maybe ill have a weak one soon and have an excuse to do some tweaking

 

[bkisel]

I thank the OP for starting this thread...

Fat, dumb and happy with my firsts two 4-week kits and then I join this site. With the last three kits I couldn't leave well enough alone and am bulk aging and messing around with home made simple syrup to back sweeten in one of them. Now this raisin tweaking stuff has me intrigued. I have gone to the links above but still have questions, please indulge me.

• Yellow raisins for white wine, black for red and maybe a mix for blush?
• One pound of raisins for a 23L/6 gal. kit, right?
• Can all quick, 4-week, kits benefit from raisin tweaking? If not which ones?
• Which RJS VDV red would you recommend for a first try at a raisin tweak?
• Is the tannin a separate tweak or must/should be done along with a raisin tweak?
• How much tannin should be used?

Thanks...

 

[geek]

bkisel, I think the raisins are for any kit based on what I've seen from joe.

 

[jamesngalveston]

trust your hydrometer and your mouth taste buds....end of story...

 

[LoneStarLori]

The raisins and tannin are added that the same time. Right after you rack from the primary into the secondary and before you add the juice back in. Don't add any chems at this time. Think of it as extending the primary a week or so.
I used 1 lb of golden raisins in my 6 gal Mezza Luna white. Don't hold back on the 4 TBL of tannin. It seems like a lot, but it works.
Here's a link to Joeswine original post, which is the one I followed along with Joe's help : http://www.winemakingtalk.com/forum/f6/when-good-wines-g-ne-bad-29481/index31.html#post410608

I am on the final clearing of my white. Today I added the fpac and am anxiously waiting for it to clear. It tastes very well rounded and I can really tell the difference from before the raisins and the body it added.

 

[bkisel]

I believe the picture is beginning to clear for me. I've scanned through much but have not read all of the "when good wines go bad" thread. I'm still not understanding whether or not adding the tannin is a tweak all by itself or part of what must be done if doing the raisin tweak. Any opinion on that? Maybe I should just PM Joe with the question?

Thanks...

 

[LoneStarLori]

According to Joe the tannins add texture to the body created by the raisins.
" The additive I use it powdered Oak tannin, that is what was in the bag. I used 4 tablespoons of this in the secondary, that's a lot. It goes a long way . I also added more at the end of the secondary fermentation ,, . I am hoping that it will add to the compositional makeup of the sangiovese


Raisins in the secondary, it is like adding an additive in flavor to the sauce. It will also create a secondary fermentation small thow it may be it will create a secondary fermentation, as the alcohol from the primary rehydrates and saturate the raisins, the raisins will give their essence , extract up and blend with the wine. If you notice the picture you will see in the bottom of the carboy a mixture of tannin and raisins, some people think it is hard to get out ,a little work never bothered me, do not chop them up. That is a waste of time because the alcohol will do a extraction. Now what happens to the SANGIOVESE it's going to rest. This is a very new wine. I believe it is like an eight week kit which you barely on two to three weeks in the making, so it is that time to set and in the meantime the Oak will add texture to the body of the wine. At least that is the plan, raisins, in the secondary are the only way to go- in the secondary. In my opinion is only a conflict other wise and no benefit to the winemaker, but that is just my opinion is the way do my thing.

This is from the very first kit modification on post # 311 http://www.winemakingtalk.com/forum/f6/when-good-wines-g-ne-bad-29481/index32.html#post417076

I know the entire thread is a long read, bit if you start at post #301 you get the big picture.

 

[vernsgal]

[*]Which RJS VDV red would you recommend for a first try at a raisin tweak?
[*]Is the tannin a separate tweak or must/should be done along with a raisin tweak?
I added a pound of raisons to RJS VDV Cab/Shiraz. I didn't add any tannins. I have to say it's still aging but when I did a taste the body was great and the taste was awesome.It's coming to month 5 now for aging so I'll give another month and taste again.

 

[bkisel]

Thanks for the highlighting. Must have read that 2-3 times myself and didn't pull the info out.

I added a pound of raisons to RJS VDV Cab/Shiraz. I didn't add any tannins. I have to say it's still aging but when I did a taste the body was great and the taste was awesome.It's coming to month 5 now for aging so I'll give another month and taste again.

Good to hear! Think if I tried it I'd just do the raisins to see what I got and then maybe the second time around add the tannin to compare.

 

[mumptia]

Pretty bad when I'm quasi hoping for a semi-fail to try a tweak lol