Skeeter Pee - Always a Struggle to Ferment Dry

[raelynn]

I consistently struggle to get Skeeter Pee to ferment dry. I have a harder time when following the original recipe which calls for 2 bottles of lemon juice at the start and 1 midway through. I've had more success adding 1 bottle at the start and the rest after fermentation is done, but it seems like no matter what I do, it gets stuck somewhere around 1.020-1.040. I have a temperature controlled box that keeps them at 72-75F, and use a degasser to whip air into them 2-3x/day. Right now, I have 2 batches that are stuck - one at 1.014 and one at 1.030. They look active and smell fine, but for the last week, they've maybe only come down 0.002. I added nutrient and energizer at 1.050 like the recipe calls. I am at a loss, especially because so many people here seem to get it to ferment dry at rocket speed. I don't know if I should pitch more yeast (esp with the one at 1.014) or what to do. If my husband didn't love this, I would just stick to Dragon Blood, which never fails me.

Also, I've ran into this regardless of whether I've used a slurry or EC-1118 (I followed the steps below, and it ferments great at the beginning, but then stalls).

Alternative to Yeast Slurry
Sanitize two quart jars.
Jar #1 - fill half full with mixed Skeeter Pee.
Jar #2 – fill ¼” with warm water, sprinkle yeast on top.
30 minutes later put 1 TBSP of Skeeter Pee in with the yeast. Swirl the jar to mix.
60 minutes later (when nice and foamy), add twice that amount of Skeeter Pee. Swirl.
Repeat every hour, adding enough Skeeter Pee to double the volume, and swirl. Continue until everything from jar #1 has been transferred to jar #2.
Let it sit overnight, swirl, and then pitch into the 5 gallon batch of Skeeter Pee.

 

[Jovimaple]

How long have they been stuck at those SG levels?

What was the starting SG for each? (My thought here is that it's starting too high and the yeast have reached their alcohol tolerance already).

Also, I wouldn't keep whipping oxygen in. The yeast need the O2 while building their colony; after that, it's not necessary anymore.

You can still stir to make sure the must is homogenized, but I wouldn't whip more O2 into it after about the first day or two.

I typically add the first 1/3 of the lemon juice during fermentation, and add the other 2/3 after it's complete.

 

[raelynn]

How long have they been stuck at those SG levels?

What was the starting SG for each? (My thought here is that it's starting too high and the yeast have reached their alcohol tolerance already).

Also, I wouldn't keep whipping oxygen in. The yeast need the O2 while building their colony; after that, it's not necessary anymore.

You can still stir to make sure the must is homogenized, but I wouldn't whip more O2 into it after about the first day or two.

I typically add the first 1/3 of the lemon juice during fermentation, and add the other 2/3 after it's complete.

The one that I pitched EC-1118 in has been stuck for 2 weeks at 1.014. I started it June 13 and the OG was 1.095, but with EC-1118 it should be fine. It's sitting at under 12% abv right now. This one had 2/3 of the lemon juice at the beginning and went really slow before it stalled.

I started another one July 9 with 1/3 of the lemon juice, using DB slurry that originally had K1-V1116. It also had OG 1.095 and is stuck at 1.030. The ABV is under 9% in it.

I'm at a loss with what to do with them. The first one is probably too close to done to re-pitch yeast, but maybe not?

 

[Jovimaple]

I had issues with K1-V1116 with a key lime skeeter pee that never did finish below about 1.010. I ended up putting it under airlock and letting it sit for a few months to even get it down to that.

If it were me, I probably would do a new starter with fresh EC-1118 for each and repitch, just to see if they will finish off.

If that doesn't work in another week or so, try racking and let them sit under airlock for a couple months and see if that makes a difference.

I don't think it's your technique at all. It could be the brand of lemon juice or just the fact that it can be tricky due to all the acid.

Edited to add: I have a Tilt hydrometer and so I checked my last 2 batches. One fermented to dry in 9 days and the other took 18. I use the same recipe every time, in the same room with the same ambient temps. Yeast can be fickle!

 

[raelynn]

I had issues with K1-V1116 with a key lime skeeter pee that never did finish below about 1.010. I ended up putting it under airlock and letting it sit for a few months to even get it down to that.

If it were me, I probably would do a new starter with fresh EC-1118 for each and repitch, just to see if they will finish off.

If that doesn't work in another week or so, try racking and let them sit under airlock for a couple months and see if that makes a difference.

I don't think it's your technique at all. It could be the brand of lemon juice or just the fact that it can be tricky due to all the acid.

Edited to add: I have a Tilt hydrometer and so I checked my last 2 batches. One fermented to dry in 9 days and the other took 18. I use the same recipe every time, in the same room with the same ambient temps. Yeast can be fickle!

I used Realemon brand lemon juice, which is the only kind I can get here that isn't Walmart/store brand. Is there any risk of a weird taste if I pitch new yeast and they don't finish off? Should I also use nutrient or energizer? Thank you for your help!

 

[Jovimaple]

I wouldn't use nutrient or energizer at this point.

I don't think there will be any issues with taste, especially if you make sure it has cleared before you bottle. During the clearing process, the yeast should all drop out anyway.

 

[raelynn]

I wouldn't use nutrient or energizer at this point.

I don't think there will be any issues with taste, especially if you make sure it has cleared before you bottle. During the clearing process, the yeast should all drop out anyway.

Thank you for your help! I opted to repitch yeast in the older of the two batches on Tuesday, since it looks like the other is making tiny, slow progress still. This morning, it looks active so fingers crossed. I really want my primaries back because I have other wine I want to make!

I tested the pH in both batches as well. The one with 2 bottles (that I just repitched yeast in) is 2.55 and the one with 1 bottle is 2.95.

 

[cmason1957]

Thank you for your help! I opted to repitch yeast in the older of the two batches on Tuesday, since it looks like the other is making tiny, slow progress still. This morning, it looks active so fingers crossed. I really want my primaries back because I have other wine I want to make!

I tested the pH in both batches as well. The one with 2 bottles (that I just repitched yeast in) is 2.55 and the one with 1 bottle is 2.95.

You may have a big challenge to get yeast happy in that 2.55 Ph one, yeast aren't very happy much below 2.8 (and some would say higher than that even)

 

[raelynn]

You may have a big challenge to get yeast happy in that 2.55 Ph one, yeast aren't very happy much below 2.8 (and some would say higher than that even)

Wouldn't everyone who follows the recipe (which calls for 2 x 32oz bottles of lemon juice at the start) run into this same low pH issue? Should I try to do anything about the pH in that batch?

 

[ratflinger]

I make mine pretty much according to the directions, at least 2/3 of the lemon juice up front. I pitch the yeast and when it stops it's done. I don't check the SG, cause at that point I don't care. I just add some kmeta & sorbate, & sugar and let it sit, to verify the yeasts are dead. I then finish it up and bottle. I like it. Sometimes we tend to over-think this stuff. If you want a little more ABV then add some Everclear.

 

[cmason1957]

Wouldn't everyone who follows the recipe (which calls for 2 x 32oz bottles of lemon juice at the start) run into this same low pH issue? Should I try to do anything about the pH in that batch?

I've never measured the Ph of skeeter pee when I have made it, I have to be honest. I do measure the SG, since I like it a little bit higher than the normal recipe calls for. It has been more than a few years since I last made it and I'm trying to remember if I followed the directions or not. I might have only added one bottle at the start, one bottle later and then a third bottle when I racked it to a carboy. I don't know what good thing you could to help the Ph, without affecting the taste. I just know yeast aren't happy at 2.55 Ph. I think if I wanted to try to get that fermenting more what I would do is start with four or five packages of EC-1118 yeast, rehydrate them and add Go-Ferm, let them sit overnight and grow a really, really good population of happy yeast. Then add about the same amount of your must as liquid to another bucket, let that go for a couple of hours and see if the yeast keep eating. Then add double the amount of wine you added the time before, wait a few hours, repeat, doubling the amount of wine you add each time.

That's my best guess and normal way to deal with ferments that give me issues. It isn't fun and takes a good amount of time.

 

[raelynn]

I make mine pretty much according to the directions, at least 2/3 of the lemon juice up front. I pitch the yeast and when it stops it's done. I don't check the SG, cause at that point I don't care. I just add some kmeta & sorbate, & sugar and let it sit, to verify the yeasts are dead. I then finish it up and bottle. I like it. Sometimes we tend to over-think this stuff. If you want a little more ABV then add some Everclear.

If alcohol wasn't so expensive in Canada, I'd buy Everclear and fortify. The cost of alcohol up here was part of the reason we decided to start making out own.

 

[raelynn]

I've never measured the Ph of skeeter pee when I have made it, I have to be honest. I do measure the SG, since I like it a little bit higher than the normal recipe calls for. It has been more than a few years since I last made it and I'm trying to remember if I followed the directions or not. I might have only added one bottle at the start, one bottle later and then a third bottle when I racked it to a carboy. I don't know what good thing you could to help the Ph, without affecting the taste. I just know yeast aren't happy at 2.55 Ph. I think if I wanted to try to get that fermenting more what I would do is start with four or five packages of EC-1118 yeast, rehydrate them and add Go-Ferm, let them sit overnight and grow a really, really good population of happy yeast. Then add about the same amount of your must as liquid to another bucket, let that go for a couple of hours and see if the yeast keep eating. Then add double the amount of wine you added the time before, wait a few hours, repeat, doubling the amount of wine you add each time.

That's my best guess and normal way to deal with ferments that give me issues. It isn't fun and takes a good amount of time.

I normally wouldn't measure the pH of Skeeter Pee either but I just got a pH meter and thought I'd play around with it. I think I will just see if the re-pitched low pH batch will do anything else, and if not, I'm gonna call it, since it's over 11% and I want the primary freed up. Next time I know not to put 2 bottles of lemon juice in.

 

[ratflinger]

11% is about as good as you're going to get. Also, you might try distillers yeast, as it's good for 18%+, but I have no idea on the flavor impact.

 

[winemaker81]

11% is about as good as you're going to get. Also, you might try distillers yeast, as it's good for 18%+, but I have no idea on the flavor impact.

He could start with another yeast, and when it quits, add a starter of the distiller's yeast, which will minimize any impact of the distiller's yeast.

 

[Jusatele]

I do a batch of the ole Sketer Pee each spring, love the stuff, and always bottle with a high gravity but I am doing a natural carbonation. I think just the nature of the product tends to have a very high original gravity also.
I like my finished product cold on a summers hot day bottled in 16 oz flip tops in a ice bath while lounging by the pool.

 

[Mrclean667]

I’m going to jump on this thread. I’ve as well in the process of my first batch of skeeter pee. It’s been over a month. Pitched yeast 2 times now. Hydrometer reading still around 1.040. I used lemon juice from Costco (no preservatives!)
Should I be pitching a third round of yeast? What am I doing wrong?
After watching countless videos and reading recipes, I figured this would be pretty simple. Well it’s been frustrating to say the least.
I didn’t or don’t remember taking an OG as the videos say it doesn’t matter and they would run it though a batch calculator for final abv.

Please help anyone.

 

[Jovimaple]

I’m going to jump on this thread. I’ve as well in the process of my first batch of skeeter pee. It’s been over a month. Pitched yeast 2 times now. Hydrometer reading still around 1.040. I used lemon juice from Costco (no preservatives!)
Should I be pitching a third round of yeast? What am I doing wrong?
After watching countless videos and reading recipes, I figured this would be pretty simple. Well it’s been frustrating to say the least.
I didn’t or don’t remember taking an OG as the videos say it doesn’t matter and they would run it though a batch calculator for final abv.

Please help anyone.

Welcome to WMT!

Some more information is needed.

Are you fermenting in a bucket or under airlock?

What recipe did you use?

What kind of yeast did you use?

Unless you have access to a lab, you always need the OG to estimate the ABV. If you don't care what the ABV is, it doesn't matter so much as a home winemaker, other than allowing you to track the progress. For instance, you know it's 1.040 NOW but did it start at that and nothing at all has happened? Or was it super high and now it's stuck because there's a lot of alcohol and the yeast is dying?

 

[Mrclean667]

Welcome to WMT!

Some more information is needed.

Are you fermenting in a bucket or under airlock?

What recipe did you use?

What kind of yeast did you use?

Unless you have access to a lab, you always need the OG to estimate the ABV. If you don't care what the ABV is, it doesn't matter so much as a home winemaker, other than allowing you to track the progress. For instance, you know it's 1.040 NOW but did it start at that and nothing at all has happened? Or was it super high and now it's stuck because there's a lot of alcohol and the yeast is dying?

Awesome response time my friend lol. Bucket with paper towel and coffee cup. Ec1118 x 2 so far.

I’m reading you can calculate abv using refractometer and hydrometer readings to calculate %

So tomorrow I’ll try that calculation I’m reading about to see where I’m at. I still need to add the rest of the lemon juice and some water and rack into Carboy. I’ve just never seen anything other than a small amount of bubbles on the top. Never anything like I’ve seen in multiple videos.

Thanks so much for the info. I’ll let you know tomorrow if that calculation works.

 

[winemaker81]

I’m reading you can calculate abv using refractometer and hydrometer readings to calculate %

Without knowing the OG, you're not going to calculate the ABV. You need original and final SG to do that. I've tried a vinometer, and agree with others they are a waste of money. There are methods where you boil a known sample size to eliminate the alcohol and measure the volume difference, but it's not anything I'd bother with.

Something to consider is the OG. If you started with an OG of 1.170 and are currently at 1.040, the EC-1118 is done. Meaning the ferment is done.

What is the overall volume of the must and how much sugar did you add? That will allow approximating the OG, with some degree of error. But close enough to figure out of the EC-1118 is maxed out.

A more likely scenario is the pH is too low, e.g., if it's below 2.9, yeast don't handle it well.

Depending on your volume, diluting the must may raise the pH enough to give the yeast a chance to work.