Need MLF advice for low pH

[GreginND]

Having mostly done fruit wines in the past I am now working with grapes and need some advice. I have three wines nearing the end of their primary fermentation and I'm behind in thinking about ML cultures. All have a pH around 2.9 which is too low for most ML cultures.

Frontenac, MN1200 and King of the North

Two questions:

What cultures are recommended for low pH?
Recommended sources for small quantities for 5 gallon batches?

Thanks.

 

[ibglowin]

Yikes!

Thats pretty low for any strain of MLB. Most of them don't like below ~3.4 or so. I would look around on the More Wine MLB page. I know there are a couple that say they will tolerate as low as 3.1. They are out of a lot of stuff now as we are in the crazy part of crush for everybody but you can always start later as long as the wine is kept warm enough. Just remember you have a lot of things to worry about with MLB. ABV, pH, SO2, temperature.

If you haven't read the More Wine MLF Manual read up on it before hand.

What is the TA on that 2.9 wine!

 

[BobF]

If it's still fermenting you prolly have tons of CO2 skewing your pH/TA results. If you didn't already do this, try nuking your sample or shake the be-hey-zeus of it to get rid of CO2 before running your tests.

This may or may not matter to the bugs, but it would be good to know the real numbers.

 

[robie]

This may not be a good idea for you as I have no idea of how much body your wine has, but one can raise the ph by adding plain water, NOT acidulated water. This is not always a good idea, but something to consider.

As Mike said, More Wine generally carries some low ph MLB. I used CH35 last year.

With such MLB, I would not start MLF with a near 0 free SO2 level. This MLB seems to take a little longer to work, so you could be facing a long phase with little protection other than some CO2 and possibly tannins. However, if you can keep it sealed up you may be OK.

I found that getting the temperature up at the higher end of the CH35 temperature tolerance works best. Mine didn't take off until I did.

Good luck.

 

[GreginND]

Robie, thanks for the insight. Really appreciated. I hesitate to dilute as I am testing these grapes for winemaking for the University to evaluate their qualities. Maybe I should just leave it without ML and see how it comes out after cold stabilization.

Bob, The pH was measured pre-fermentation. I have not checked it since adding yeast. These are typical numbers for our area.

Thank you.

 

[robie]

Robie, thanks for the insight. Really appreciated. I hesitate to dilute as I am testing these grapes for winemaking for the University to evaluate their qualities. Maybe I should just leave it without ML and see how it comes out after cold stabilization.

Bob, The pH was measured pre-fermentation. I have not checked it since adding yeast. These are typical numbers for our area.

Thank you.

I don't blame you for not wanting to dilute, I just wanted you to know that water wil bring the PH up of a low PH wine. The PH and TA levels will change some during fermentation.

Are you sure about the PH reading? It sure seems awfully low. I would say to order a low PH MLB, because it is still going to be low after fermentation. Check the Ph again after fermentation is very near completion.

 

[grapeman]

I have been able to coax Scott Labs MBR31 to work at around 3.0 although they say it works to 3.1
http://www.scottlab.com/product-136.aspx
I am surprised that you could not get the fruit riper, especially the Mn1200. We had a pH of 3.30 average with a TA from 6.8 to 8.0 g/L depending on the training system. Even the Frontenac is well above 3.1 this year and the TA is the lowest we have ever had here.

By the way, I just barreled up 60 gallons of Mn1200 this year so far.

 

[GreginND]

Yes, I wish they could have let these hang another week or so, but it didn't turn out that way. And I obtained these grapes rather suddenly, so I wasn't as prepared for them as I would have liked. I only had V1116 yeast on hand. Next time I will use a yeast strain that can metabolize more of the acid.

This is my first time working with MN1200 and I have to say I am quite impressed with it already. Even though my pH is low the TA is not too bad at 8.7 g/L. And the flavor already is earthy and quite nice with some developing chocolate notes. I hope those flavors stick around until it's finished. I think I need to make a trip to Champlain Valley to taste some good MN1200!

The frontenac is at 14.6 !! Way too high. I don't think I'll be able to drop that too much. I think this is destined to be sweetened to balance that acid.

The KOTN is, well, King of the North. Not my ideal wine grape. Another sweet one for the wife, I think!