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steviepointer

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If you saw my other thread, I was asking about proper temp about clearing my Island Mist Blueberry Pinot.

I had degased, and the wine is now clearing. The carboy temp was 61. I decided to put a brewbelt on it last night.

This morning, I go to check on the wine. The temp is at 75. But, here is the problem.

All of the lees floated to the top, and the airlock overflowed with wine, and ran over the carboy. The airlock is now full of wine.

At 61F, I had the wine 2" from the bottom of the bung (which put the wine level right at the neck of the carboy.

I'm assuming that at 75F, the wine expanded, and over filled the airlock.

Now what do I do? Do I take the brewbelt off, and let it cool back down? If so, do I have to worry about any extra headspace?

Do I keep the brew belt on? Just take the airlock off, clean it out, and put it back on? Do I syphon some wine out, so there is some headspace in there?

What about the floating lees?
 

rawlus

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hmm.

i would take wine out of the carboy to reduce the volume a bit, and let that settle in a winebottle or gallon jug with the rest settling in the carboy.

you are sure fermentation has completed correct? the addition of heat did not restart any sort of fermentation which caused foaming up through the airlock? just want to be absolutely sure fermentation has completed and that it didn't merely stall when you moved the carboys to those 61* temps.
 

steviepointer

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I don't think fermentation started. Per the instructions, I added Sorbate and then the fpack. Then it sat at 61F for a few days, with no change in airlock level.

It was only after I put the brew belt on, the overflow happened.

I did put the belt on lower, on the carboy. I wonder if that heated up the lees, and got them to float?!?
 

ffemt128

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I think it was due to a combination of things. The temperature was increased this could be part of the issue, you could also be experiencing changed in atmospheric pressure. I had a batch of mine do the same thing with no changes in temp. It was either when a storm was coming in or going out, I can't remember. That was my explaination for the rise in volume.

It sounded good when I heard it.
 

WhineMaker

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I think you may end up needing more clearing agents.. By stirring up the lees that much, it's going to make it tough to clear on its own I would think. After it settles down, see if you can pull any more gas out of it, hopefully it did not start fermenting again.. Good luck!!
 

Torch404

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You don't think fermentation started? Why do you think this? Please explain why you continued onto the other steps.

When you added sorbate did you also add k-meta(sulfites)? Sorbate only prevent the yeast from reproducing the ones that are still alive and likely dormant from the temp. They started going again when the temp changed and lifted the lees with co2. With sorbate added you might have some difficulties getting it going again.
 

Tom

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1st waht the garvity?
2nd did yoiu add the k-meta AND sorbate BEFORE adding the f-pac?
@ 61* the yeast may have gone dorment @ 70*+ it could have woke up the yeast.
More info please.
 

Wade E

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We definitely need to know the sg before you stabilized. Since i cant remember if this is a kit or not then please either refer me back to the existing thread or tell me what this is. While working on a wine you need to stay with the same thread so that we know what you are working on, we answer a lot of questions here so trying to remember what everyone is working on is nearly impossible. Did you sweeten this wine after stabilizing and if so did you take an sg reading then? If you did take a reading now to see if its the same. I can see the temp making the wine expand pr just a barometric pressuer change doing this but lees floating to the top also is not something Ive ever seen happen and doesnt make sense to me. Do you have any airlock activity now?
 

steviepointer

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Thanks for all the replies.

This is the Island Mist Blueberry Pinot Noir kit.

I don't have my log handy, but IIRC, SG was .992 (maybe .994) for 3 consecutive days. I degased by using a stirrer and drill for about 5min. I degassed by spinning the drill at high RPM, but stopped before a vortex formed. I then quickly reversed direction. Back and forth for 5min. I then added packets #2 (Kmeta) and #3 (sorbate). Degassed for another 5min.

I then added the FPack, and stirred once again (I think for 2min). IIRC, SG was 1.08 after the fpack addition.

Does that help? I appreciate all of the responses. Let me know if you need anything else to help you help me.

So far today, all I did was unplug the brewbelt. I haven't done anything else (like remove the airlock). No airlock activity. Want me to take a picture of the floating lees?

Thanks a bunch!
 
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steviepointer

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Here are some pictures:







Brewbelt has been unplugged for about 12hr.

The temp has since dropped to 65F. Oh, and the overflowed wine tastes pretty good. :d

Thanks for any help.
 

Wade E

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Okay thats is what we needed but just one more question just because its the only thing I can think of why this happened so here it goes, what temp was the wine at when you degassed? The reason I ask this is because Im thinking it may not have been warm enough for the wine to degas and now that you got it all warmed up its degassing 3 fold! If it was in the mid 70's then I really dont have a explanation for why this happened bjut I also use a different fining agent that settles hard to the bottom unlike the isinglass which usually stays fluffy which can float easily and is easily disturbed when trying to rack off of.
 

Wade E

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Shake the carboy gently a little a few times a day and it should fall right back down. remove tha airlock also and replace the liquid with kmeta soltion. If you just use water this is a good reason to switch to meta or vodka or something more sanitary as the water will go stagnant and then bad and when or if this wine got cold again or if the barometric pressure changed back the volume will go down creating avacuum which will suck the fluid back into the carboy. What has just happened is also a good reason that I will never use a solid bung as this would have popped that solid bung out or if taped down might have created enough pressure to blow the carboy (I dought it but ya never know) or just push a taped solid bung enough to the side to spray the walls.
 

Tom

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Wade seems to be spot on.
When you racked it did you add any water to fill up the carboy? If so how much.
 

steviepointer

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I did not add any water. In fact, I had to draw out 1L (per directions) to make room for the fpack. I did add in about 250ml of wine back in, just to top off, and bring the level within 2" of the bung.

I think when I degassed, it was about 65F. So, there would be a 10F difference.

I think I have a bag of superkleer. Should I turn the belt back on, and then attempt to degas again, and add in the superkleer?
 

Wade E

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Thats why you have to degas your wine at warmer temps! This is C02 coming out of suspension now and when its doing this its bringing the lees up with it! I would let it cool down again so that the lees settle back out without using another fining agent. Just gently shake it like I said and it should fall back out but let it cool down first as right now if you do that youll just shake more C02 out keeping the lees suspended. Once it all settles back down you will want to rack off these lees to a clean carboy and then warm it up again and degas it unless you like the sligh sparkle in it which some people do.
 

rawlus

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there seem to be an awful lot of winemakers having issues with temps lately. if they take nothing else from these many threads, i think the clear point is, you cannot just stick these wines into a 60*F basement and hope everything is going to turn out fantastic.

basement temps are typically not at all suitable for winemaking except during bulk aging and/or storage. kitchen temps are much better for the bulk of the process.
 

steviepointer

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just fyi...I shook the bottle yesterday. Most of the lees have settled back down.

There is still some floating.. I hope to shake the bottle a few more times today, and hope the lees will settle back down.

I don't have a 2nd carboy to rack to. Can I temporarily rack to the primary? Then, clean the lees out, and move back to the carboy? I'm assuming I should be ok, since I need to degass again (this time, at a warmer temp).

Thanks!
 

robie

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Sounds to me like fermentation started back up when the temperature went up.
Did you add sulphite as well as sorbate?

Sorbate doesn't kill the yeast, it only keeps those, which are still living, from reproducing.
If you didn't add sulphite , if those still-alive yeasts got some sugar and a nice comfortable temperature, they likely went back to work.

At this point, make sure you did add sulphite , place wine back in a larger container and let the yeast eat until they die. You may have to back sweeten the wine, since the yeast will convert some of the F pack's sugars.

Maybe your sorbate or sulphite were old...
 

Tom

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just fyi...I shook the bottle yesterday. Most of the lees have settled back down.

There is still some floating.. I hope to shake the bottle a few more times today, and hope the lees will settle back down.

I don't have a 2nd carboy to rack to. Can I temporarily rack to the primary? Then, clean the lees out, and move back to the carboy? I'm assuming I should be ok, since I need to degass again (this time, at a warmer temp).

Thanks!
Yes. What's the gravity?
 
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