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Discussion in 'General Wine Making Forum' started by berrycrush, Jan 22, 2020.
What kind of carboy bun/seal is this guy using?
* does not appear to be actively fermenting (exploding)
* solid silicone with zip ties to hold em in?
I'm not completely sure I want to know, I might get stupid and try something similar.
I do agree, it does not appear to be actively fermenting, if it were, those are just waiting to make a mess.
I agree, looks like solid silicone with zip ties to keep them in place. I experimented with a similar system before designing the wine room carboy holders, solid silicone bung with hose clamps; one clamp around the neck to hold the second, which went over the bung. Super solid arrangement, but could commit to it and designed racks to hold standing carboys........
It look kind of neat and organized although I'm not sure how much of a space saver it is. I just measured a 5 and 6 gallon carboy. The 5 is about a 10" diameter and 20" tall and a 6 is 11 and 22 so if the carboys were placed front to back it would take the same space. Plus you wouldn't have to worry about the bungs
Just seeing them like that does make me a little nervous. One positive thing is that leaking bungs would be easy to spot. I think a drain trough might be needed just in case.....
My immediate thought was "oh gosh, the risk of leaks". That quickly turned to "how the heck to you get those carboys up there?".
Risk vs. reward? He should look into getting a barrel.
Isn't that Randall Grahm in the picture?
If so, he's quite the famous winemaker. I seem to remember he had a project that involved 100s of carboys.
He's the founder of Bonny Doon, and one of the "Rhone Rangers". A controversial guy in many ways.
Interesting what it says about "elevage" in the glass carboy:
"The idea of “raising” the wine in glass demijohns was also a bit of a fever dream, occasioned in part by the many hours I spent in deep contemplation of the mysteries of redox chemistry; there was something dream-like (à la Carlos Castaneda and Don Juan) about the many hours driving around southern France with Patrick Ducournau, deep thinker about oxygen and wine (and inventor of microbullage, or micro-oxygenation). I’ve already written quite a bit about the nature of the esoteric élevage en bonbonne—bâtonage magnetique, etc., the opportunity for the wine to digest a substantial volume of yeast lees, and the extraordinary texture and savoriness this protocol engenders."
@CDrew do you have any information about the carboy project? There may be something of value to this method of storage. What comes to mind is that any oxygen that passes through the silicone bung goes straight to the wine and not the headspace, this allows the wine to consume the oxygen without it oxidizing the surface or feeding microbes on the surface of the wine. I'm not sure if it makes any practical difference, just that it is theoretically different.
Not really. I read an article about him a year or two ago when he was selling Bonny Doon and moving on to other ventures. This one:
I do think that there is some science there, though. That "Le Cigare Volant" was always one of Bonny Doon's top end wine, and aged in carboys apparently. Pretty cool.
Isn’t there some value in racking an undisturbed carboy? Laying them flat would take 2-3 days to settle again before racking. So, for that reason, I’m out. (My best shark tank impersonation)
I think in this case he's leaving the wine on lees.
I know folks use them but I keep hearing negatives about those handles on large carboys - as in snapped off carboy tops. So as someone else said - I'm out
Yes that's him. Here is the original article:
I noticed that there are an enormous amount of articles about Randall Grahm. The one below is fairly extensive and really confirms again what we already know, that there are many different opinions about what wine should be etc. I included a few highlights from the article that give some idea of what his opinions are.
The Rhône region got its first big break in the 1980s, when the powerful U.S. wine critic Robert Parker started giving the French wines high scores. That endorsement also helped their New World counterparts. Today, syrah is the fastest-growing, most popular Rhône wine in America—thanks to the Australian invasion of the shiraz, the same grape with a slightly different name. It’s made in a ripe, round style that’s less austere than the French version.
But Grahm isn’t a fan. He describes Australian shiraz as a caricature of syrah: “It’s a thoroughly corrupted grape; it’s got too much of everything. It is not what syrah is about. Syrah is a very refined grape, not a powerhouse wine. It’s a finesse wine, and that’s not a style that’s particularly encouraged in Australia.
To be successful today, Grahm says, wine must be “optically opaque, alcoholic, tannic and woody as hell—its vinous Viagrafication.” Despite this sensory onslaught, he opines, “It might be nice if the tannins were strong but on some level soft—sort of like George Clooney or Harrison Ford.”
He believes that winemakers do have a choice: “Either follow your own vision of producing a wine that the world needs—a wine of originality and distinctiveness—or else just create the illusion of distinctiveness by amping up the volume. If you’re in Burgundy, distinctiveness arises from the soil. In the New World, the dilemma is how to legitimize your efforts without relying on the usual suspects: concentration, big fruit, new wood, the Wine Spec and Parker.”
Getting the timing right is essential for harvest. Pick too early in the season, and the grapes may not be ripe; too late, and excess sugar converts into a clobbering alcohol without any balancing acidity. Still, many New World vintners deliberately pick late in the season. Grahm criticizes these “high-impact wines” as boringly overripe. “As primates, we prefer ripe fruit, whether it’s bananas or grapes. It’s just human nature,” he says. “But these wines are like baby food for grown-ups—puréed things with butter and cream in them.” He feels that highly alcoholic wines overwhelm subtle food, just as the new trend to fusion cooking overwhelms nuanced wines.
In fact, New World wines have become increasingly alcoholic in the last five years. Where 10-12 percent alcohol by volume used to be the norm, modern blockbuster reds, such as shiraz and cabernet, often weigh in at 15 percent. Not only do these wines assault the palate, but they make their presence known only when you get up from the dinner table and discover that your legs have turned to jelly.
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