RJ Spagnols RJ Spagnols Cellar Craft Winery Series Super Tuscan

[smcalli1]

I racked the Super Tuscan yesterday and in the process of siphoning drew a sample. (It's been aging since January.) The color was perfect, but there was an aroma on the nose I didn't expect. And when I tasted it, there was an odd sweetness. It wasn't off-putting, but not what I was expecting. I'm going to pull another sample this evening. Perhaps my taste buds were off yesterday. But has anyone else had the same experience with this kit?

 

[Rocky]

Smcalli, I have made this kit a number of times and, while none of it was "bone dry," I would not call it sweet. Are you sure you are not just tasting the fruit? My experience has been that it does have a lot of fruit taste. It has to be in my top 5 kits and may be Number1.

 

[smcalli1]

Smcalli, I have made this kit a number of times and, while none of it was "bone dry," I would not call it sweet. Are you sure you are not just tasting the fruit? My experience has been that it does have a lot of fruit taste. It has to be in my top 5 kits and may be Number1.

It could be Rocky. I was expecting something dry and earthy (which is my preference) and it may have been that the fruitiness fooled me into thinking it was sweet. I'll let you know what tonight's tasting provides. If its the same, I may add some tannin or oak cubes. We'll see.

 

[Grasshopper]

Might the off aroma and flavor be "kit taste"? I made the RJS Super Tuscan at the end of June last year and bottled it in early February. I opened a bottle this week and was surprised to find that it has a noticeable kit taste. The KT is less than in my WE Chilean Pinot made just prior to the ST but it still there. I did not expect KT to be an issue based on the rave reviews and claims that this wine is good early and better later.

Two questions: first, is KT normal for this kit? More importantly, is KT influenced by technique? This was my third kit and done before I purchased my All-in-One pump. Among other things, I probably beat a lot of air into the wine trying to degas with my drill stirrer. I understand that some people are more sensitive to this taste than others and I might be among these unfortunate ones, but if there is anything I can do or not do to reduce KT, I would like to know.

 

[phat]

Might the off aroma and flavor be "kit taste"? I made the RJS Super Tuscan at the end of June last year and bottled it in early February. I opened a bottle this week and was surprised to find that it has a noticeable kit taste. The KT is less than in my WE Chilean Pinot made just prior to the ST but it still there. I did not expect KT to be an issue based on the rave reviews and claims that this wine is good early and better later.

Two questions: first, is KT normal for this kit? More importantly, is KT influenced by technique? This was my third kit and done before I purchased my All-in-One pump. Among other things, I probably beat a lot of air into the wine trying to degas with my drill stirrer. I understand that some people are more sensitive to this taste than others and I might be among these unfortunate ones, but if there is anything I can do or not do to reduce KT, I would like to know.

Very early on I noticed mine had some kit taste to it - was gone by the time I bottled it (8 months or so in). This one I noticed was quite senstive on bottling and tasted pretty green for a few months after bottling which was not the case out of the splits that I drank right away when bottling it. Time healed everything and after a few months in the bottle it's very very good.

In my experience Kit Taste goes away with time. let it sit, and it will get better.

As for the poster looking for earthy - I wouldn't call this kit earthy - it's a fairly fruit forward red - not a "fruit bomb" but I wouldn't say it's earthy...

 

[smcalli1]

Well, I tasted it again last night and I'm afraid the wine is going to vinegar. I must have been incomplete in my sanitizing at some point. I'm really disappointed.

 

[roger80465]

I think I am going to cry.

 

[phat]

Well, I tasted it again last night and I'm afraid the wine is going to vinegar. I must have been incomplete in my sanitizing at some point. I'm really disappointed.

Well, they do say you learn more from your mistakes than you do from your successes.. I know I do.. But that still really sucks.

You sure it's vinegar? the whole thing or just some of the bottles?

Do give it another try if you get the chance. It's a pretty darn good kit.

 

[smcalli1]

Well, they do say you learn more from your mistakes than you do from your successes.. I know I do.. But that still really sucks.

You sure it's vinegar? the whole thing or just some of the bottles?

Do give it another try if you get the chance. It's a pretty darn good kit.

It's still in carboy bulk aging. I've not entirely given up on it yet. I currently have a cold and that may be affecting my tastebuds. I tried some commercial chianti last night and thought it had an off taste too. My wife thought it was fine though. We'll see.

 

[SouthernChemist]

Well, I tasted it again last night and I'm afraid the wine is going to vinegar. I must have been incomplete in my sanitizing at some point. I'm really disappointed.

I wouldn't necessarily believe you're making vinegar at this point. How clear is the wine? Is there a noticeable vinegar aroma? I've seen examples of homemade vinegar, and you can easily see the 'mother' (from the acetobacter bacteria) sitting on the bottom in the wine. The process can take weeks, though. It could just be a quirk of its development.

 

[smcalli1]

I wouldn't necessarily believe you're making vinegar at this point. How clear is the wine? Is there a noticeable vinegar aroma? I've seen examples of homemade vinegar, and you can easily see the 'mother' (from the acetobacter bacteria) sitting on the bottom in the wine. The process can take weeks, though. It could just be a quirk of its development.

Unfortunately, I have a cold so can't rely on my senses at the moment. I'm not doing anything just yet with it. I'll wait until I can clear my cold or get a knowledgable friend to try it out. The wine is clear but very dark and I don't see any "mother" sitting on the bottom of the carboy.

 

[phat]

It's still in carboy bulk aging. I've not entirely given up on it yet. I currently have a cold and that may be affecting my tastebuds. I tried some commercial chianti last night and thought it had an off taste too. My wife thought it was fine though. We'll see.

Then I'd wait and see.. Don't give up just yet.

 

[smcalli1]

As I thought, my cold was affecting my taste buds. I retried it yesterday and was relieved that there was no hint of vinegar. Whew!

 

[tonyt]

Degas some more and make sure youve added kmeta as needed. I'll bet that helps a bunch. I have done this kit recently and love it because it is almost off dry and a fruit bomb.

 

[rrussell]

This is my favorite kit to make. Everyone likes it and asks me what it is. All I can tell them is that it is a blend. Does anyone know what it is a blend of? Thanks.

 

[Brian55]

This is my favorite kit to make. Everyone likes it and asks me what it is. All I can tell them is that it is a blend. Does anyone know what it is a blend of? Thanks.

Crack cocaine, high dollar strippers, and magic powder...
All joking aside, this just happens to be one of the consistently best kits available at this time. Enjoy it while it lasts, as the source will eventually run dry. At which point some other premium kit will claim this notoriety, for a time...

 

[jgmann67]

This is my favorite kit to make. Everyone likes it and asks me what it is. All I can tell them is that it is a blend. Does anyone know what it is a blend of? Thanks.

I looked and couldn't find much in the way of any specifics. ST's are typically a blend of cab and Sangiovese. But, I know this one also has a merlot grape skin pack.

 

[roger80465]

I just received another Super Tuscan, this time under the "En Premeur Winery Series" brand. I noticed the oak has changed from 4 oz untoasted or light toasted chips to what appears to be the same volume of a medium toast chip. I realize this change is quite recent but has anyone made both kits and what, if any differences have you noticed in flavor?

I have some light toast chips and I am contemplating using them instead of the medium toast in order to maintain the same tannin levels and consistent flavor profile. I'd certainly appreciate some comparisons.

 

[vernsgal]

I just received another Super Tuscan, this time under the "En Premeur Winery Series" brand. I noticed the oak has changed from 4 oz untoasted or light toasted chips to what appears to be the same volume of a medium toast chip. I realize this change is quite recent but has anyone made both kits and what, if any differences have you noticed in flavor?

I have some light toast chips and I am contemplating using them instead of the medium toast in order to maintain the same tannin levels and consistent flavor profile. I'd certainly appreciate some comparisons.

As you said,it is too early for anyone to have an aged wine from this new version but I personally added more oak and tannin to secondary tin my older kit and I have to say ,at 14 months,it's one of my best.I think they've had ,or read a lot of people saying they Oaked this one up so they've responded.
I'm trying a few of their new ones myself.
If you go by the new version please keep us posted on your review. That's one of the things this forum is good for(I don't think the extra oak in primary is going to make any big change)

 

[roger80465]

As you said,it is too early for anyone to have an aged wine from this new version but I personally added more oak and tannin to secondary tin my older kit and I have to say ,at 14 months,it's one of my best.I think they've had ,or read a lot of people saying they Oaked this one up so they've responded.
I'm trying a few of their new ones myself.
If you go by the new version please keep us posted on your review. That's one of the things this forum is good for(I don't think the extra oak in primary is going to make any big change)

It is next up, after I empty a few carboys and make room for it.

I also added oak to secondary (once 2 oz medium French cubes and once 3 oz Tuscan Blend cubes from Midwest Supplies). It just seems to me the change from light toast to medium toast is going to reduce the tannins in the primary a little so it has me scratching my head just a bit. This kit was soooo good as it was, that changes by the manufacturer are like tugging on Superman's cape.

Oh well, guess I will just make it according to instructions and decide a few months down the road what tweaks (if any) to apply. I have to keep reminding myself that time is my ally.