Sounds like this process might cause more marital disputes when it's intended to give us a shared interest, but there you are. We haven't even added the yeast and already we're arguing.....My husband is concerned about dog hair ( we have my son's german shepard and cat for the summer and although we vacuum regularly, he's concerned about airborne contaminates). He wants to keep sealing the bucket with the airlock on. I've had more time to read and everyone seems to suggest a piece of muslin draped over the top will do during first ferment to aerate the yeast. Can anyone who's done this weigh in and resolve our dispute? Also, We used a recipe that called for adding 5 campden tablets to the must right off the bat. The woman at the wine store says this is too much and will inhibit our ability to get a ferment going....I'm stirring it every hour from the bottom to aerate...are we done for our of the gate? And...we didn't use the fermentation bag ( surely will with the next batch ) But should be transfer it into a bag now? Before adding the yeast? or just rack the first batch without...and how do we do that? With a sterilized strainer and a funnel and small bucket? or can we just siphon?
marital dispute: to airlock primary or not?
- Thread starter calhce
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Sounds like your in the same predicament as i am, from what I've read and suggestion from this site, an open cover is the best option to ensure that enough oxygen is getting to the must. However i too have the animal hair issue that is making it difficult to decided whether to cover with an air lock or leave it open and cover with a cheese cloth. if there is any location in your house that you can seal off from animal intervention, and keep the fermenting temperature consistent and with in the right range, than a cloth should work, giving it a better chance to ferment. if you cant, than an airlock will work fine, some experts even suggest airlocks for novice and beginner winemakers. my issue is i am not seeing that much activity in my airlock to ensure its working, and opening the 2 gallon bucket would require the tab being ripped no longer allowing the top to seal again, which is common in most food grade buckets, so if you do decide to change, you have to make sure you're ready and positive that's what you want.
As far as the campden tablets go this link should give some insight into the proper use! I am no expert, just a beginner, but i thought i would put my two cents in because everyone else seems so helpful on this site! hope all goes well!
http://winemakermag.com/629-should-...-do-i-measure-the-level-of-sulfite-in-my-wine
As far as the campden tablets go this link should give some insight into the proper use! I am no expert, just a beginner, but i thought i would put my two cents in because everyone else seems so helpful on this site! hope all goes well!
http://winemakermag.com/629-should-...-do-i-measure-the-level-of-sulfite-in-my-wine
wineforfun
Still Trying To Make The Perfect Wine and Now Tryi
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As Julie stated, concerning the lid.
Concerning your fermentation bag, use it next time and just move forward with this batch. It will be a good learning lesson as to why to use one. If you want to minimize the sediment brought from the primary to secondary, rack it "through" a mesh bag, muslin cloth, etc.
Concerning your fermentation bag, use it next time and just move forward with this batch. It will be a good learning lesson as to why to use one. If you want to minimize the sediment brought from the primary to secondary, rack it "through" a mesh bag, muslin cloth, etc.
Whitehrs
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I do not believe I've ever not put the lid tight. My bucket has a grommet for the airlock. I have left it off on one or two batches.. The airlock that is. but normally I airlock away. of course, I'm making 1 gallon batches in a 1.5 gallon bucket, I know that this makes a difference.. there is about 4 to 5 inches of space from surface to lid, and If I left the lid tight without airlock it would still transfer air in and out. Lay a towel over it. get some rubber bands the will fit around your bucket.. Bungy the towel down over the top of the bucket. I think it's all good.
There are a majority of chemical plants, and refineries around the area where I live.. The wild yeast here are probably MAd MAxx mega mutants. I don't think I would want them in my Wine..
Either way, I doubt this argument is worth a divorce. SO, Go with what she says..
There are a majority of chemical plants, and refineries around the area where I live.. The wild yeast here are probably MAd MAxx mega mutants. I don't think I would want them in my Wine..
Either way, I doubt this argument is worth a divorce. SO, Go with what she says..
Hahaha, I love the advice to follow your wife's advice ( being the wife ). In the meantime, I read that sealing the bucket is one of the major reasons for primary fermentation failure and read it to him while he was home for lunch....so it looks like I won this round - and I'm hoping, the right to be taken as a serious partner in this undertaking. I think that the addition of so many campden tablets makes it especially necessary to aerate well ( I'm guessing of course ) We will use a cheese cloth with elastic of some sort... through primary and see how it goes. I appreciate the suggestion of using the bag during the first racking to eliminate some of the pulp - in fact all of the suggestions. How wonderful it is to have company during what is a stressful time - bringing our first batch of wine into this world....with just as much conflicting advice and experience as bringing our first child - hoping this one is a lot less painful - but ends the first one did....with a great glass of wine.
lilvixen
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I have pet hair and dust concerns as well.
I've handled the lid/airlock thing differently with each batch.
- On wine kit 1 and 2 (juice only), I snapped the lid down and used an airlock per the kit instructions.
- On wine kit 3 (with skins), I only snapped down the front of the lid, leaving the back to just rest on the bucket and covered the back with a towel to keep the pet hair and dust out (combination of forum recommendations and my concerns).
- On my current batch (fresh fruit wine), I left the lid off and covered with tea towels for the first 2.5 days of fermentation because it was so vigorous. This morning, I placed the lid back on, and I'll probably add an airlock tonight.
I had a wine in the airlock of kit 3 before I cracked the lid, which is what led me to crack the lid. In the future, I'll likely set the lid in place without snapping it down and cover the airlock hole with a towel unless it's particularly vigorous. I haven't seen any pet hair in the current batch using just a towel, but I tense up every time a dog or cat goes near the bucket to investigate the sounds and smells.
I've handled the lid/airlock thing differently with each batch.
- On wine kit 1 and 2 (juice only), I snapped the lid down and used an airlock per the kit instructions.
- On wine kit 3 (with skins), I only snapped down the front of the lid, leaving the back to just rest on the bucket and covered the back with a towel to keep the pet hair and dust out (combination of forum recommendations and my concerns).
- On my current batch (fresh fruit wine), I left the lid off and covered with tea towels for the first 2.5 days of fermentation because it was so vigorous. This morning, I placed the lid back on, and I'll probably add an airlock tonight.
I had a wine in the airlock of kit 3 before I cracked the lid, which is what led me to crack the lid. In the future, I'll likely set the lid in place without snapping it down and cover the airlock hole with a towel unless it's particularly vigorous. I haven't seen any pet hair in the current batch using just a towel, but I tense up every time a dog or cat goes near the bucket to investigate the sounds and smells.
Scooter68
Fruit "Wine" Maker
Let us not forget the dreaded fruit flies as well. That's why I tie my cloth covers down. More than once a fruit fly or two has shown up, those worry me more than a cat or dog hair. (I probably inhale more cat and dog hair every day than could find it's way to a modestly covered fermentation bucket.)
To me the cloth covers are easy, cheap, easy to store and Secure nicely with a piece of yarn. I can also tie a tag to the bucket with the yard to record who, what, when for each batch and I move and update the tag when I rack the wine. (Especially needed when I had 5 or 6 different batches in different stages at the same time.) I even cut up some leftover plastic window blind vanes, drilled the and used permanent pens to mark on them. The plastic won't tear and it can get wet and and not lose the info on it. - Just something I had around the place
To me the cloth covers are easy, cheap, easy to store and Secure nicely with a piece of yarn. I can also tie a tag to the bucket with the yard to record who, what, when for each batch and I move and update the tag when I rack the wine. (Especially needed when I had 5 or 6 different batches in different stages at the same time.) I even cut up some leftover plastic window blind vanes, drilled the and used permanent pens to mark on them. The plastic won't tear and it can get wet and and not lose the info on it. - Just something I had around the place
bkisel
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In my opinion and albeit limited experience you can lock it down after a good stirring and pitching the yeast. Done it lots of times when there was no need for punching down/stirring such as when you've got a grape pack or fruit in a nylon bag. Even with that you could unseal to stir or punch down and then return it to airlock.
Now I know its easy for me to say seeing as I'm the boss in my relationship. Like when I tell my wife to leave the kitchen when I'm about to vacuum and mop the floor... she leaves immediately!
Now I know its easy for me to say seeing as I'm the boss in my relationship. Like when I tell my wife to leave the kitchen when I'm about to vacuum and mop the floor... she leaves immediately!
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"he's the man" song. Very funny!
[ame]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uy5gRxjxHtg[/ame]
[ame]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uy5gRxjxHtg[/ame]
dcbrown73
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During active fermentation, the pressure can build up enough to blow your airlock off. (it's happen to me) This is why I only place the lid on top, but do not snap it down during primary fermentation.
Secondary fermentation, I use the airlock in a carboy. For the next two weeks while it's oaking clearing, I use an airlock. Once that is done (with the use of the AIO for racking which also degasses it) I then switch to a silicone breathable bung and at that point. I'm done with standard airlocks.
Secondary fermentation, I use the airlock in a carboy. For the next two weeks while it's oaking clearing, I use an airlock. Once that is done (with the use of the AIO for racking which also degasses it) I then switch to a silicone breathable bung and at that point. I'm done with standard airlocks.
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I do an open ferment in tubs. I simply loosely cover the tub with a plastic sheet. There is no need for an airlock until the SG dips to about 1.
You should leave about 30% empty headspace during primary fermentation.
You should leave about 30% empty headspace during primary fermentation.
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Like every answer in poker, I think the answer is "it depends". What are you making? Is it a vigorous fermenter or a slow fermenter? Do you have tannin in the must or none? Is it at 65 degrees or 85 degrees? Is it just starting fermentation or is it nearing completion? Have you had experience with this sugar%, pH, yeast, temperature combination in the past?
My reading said that yeast need some oxygen during a phase of their development, however oxygen can de damaging to the wine as well at some point, so you have these two opposing points that have to be reconciled into an winemaking approach.
In general, my vigorous ferments are open top, my slow or nearly completed are closed, but stirred (exposed to oxygen) once or twice a day until it's under 1 brix. It's worked for me.
My reading said that yeast need some oxygen during a phase of their development, however oxygen can de damaging to the wine as well at some point, so you have these two opposing points that have to be reconciled into an winemaking approach.
In general, my vigorous ferments are open top, my slow or nearly completed are closed, but stirred (exposed to oxygen) once or twice a day until it's under 1 brix. It's worked for me.
Jericurl
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I live in west Texas and have multiple animals, including chickens.
So we deal with dirt, dust, fur, and feathers.
I only airlock during primary if I have fruit flies around. Otherwise, the bucket lid left on loosely or a tea towel over the top of it works just fine.
So we deal with dirt, dust, fur, and feathers.
I only airlock during primary if I have fruit flies around. Otherwise, the bucket lid left on loosely or a tea towel over the top of it works just fine.
Spikedlemon
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I usually airlock. I've got a very hairy dog and two small kids (who'll leave the screen door open regularly)
I've done a few where I've set the lid on lightly.
If you're going to open it to stir the cap of grapes: the decision to use an airlock+lid or not would not be determined by O2 levels but rather headspace/vigor (see @dcbrown73 comment). Stirring will ensure that you'll likely have sufficient O2 in the must (though deeper reading would indicate that O2 levels should never be a concern as you'll have more than enough O2 dissolved in the must for the yeast from your initial stir starting the kit)
What yeast are you using? Most wine yeasts are tolerant to a KMS dosed environment.
I've done a few where I've set the lid on lightly.
If you're going to open it to stir the cap of grapes: the decision to use an airlock+lid or not would not be determined by O2 levels but rather headspace/vigor (see @dcbrown73 comment). Stirring will ensure that you'll likely have sufficient O2 in the must (though deeper reading would indicate that O2 levels should never be a concern as you'll have more than enough O2 dissolved in the must for the yeast from your initial stir starting the kit)
What yeast are you using? Most wine yeasts are tolerant to a KMS dosed environment.
