Sorbate & More Juice 2 Weeks Out To Make Up For Lost Volume?

[critterhunter]

Here’s the deal…

After about 5 or 6 days of fermenting we just moved our wine from the 7 gallon primary bucket to a 5 gallon glass carboy yesterday. This wine was made from 30+ pounds of pears, 1 & ½ gallons of Juicy Juice Raspberry/Apple juice, 10 pounds of sugar, and used champagne yeast.

We didn’t put the pears in a mesh bag and when we racked it to the carboy yesterday we ran the juice through a kitchen screener. One day later as it stands right now about half the carboy is filled with sediment. I’m sure this sediment will compress over the next week or two.

However, we probably are going to make up for a good bit of lost volume when we rack it again in say a week or two. Perhaps a gallon to a gallon and a half let’s say maybe.

This batch should have a very high alcohol content that we wouldn’t mind watering down. Our prior batch also used 30+ pounds of pears, 10 pounds of sugar, and champain yeast, and turned out great…But with this new batch the pears were much more ripe (sweet) and the gallon and a half of Raspberry/Apple juice was also pretty sweet, so I expect this batch might have a good bit more alchohol content then we even want…Mobbing the taste of the wine somewhat.

So, with all the above in mind and the fact that we probably are going to lose a good bit of volume the next time we rack it, and as said we’d like to water down the alchohol content anyway, we were wondering if we could make up for that lost volume by pouring more of the Raspberry/Apple juice in along with Sorbate to prevent it from also converting that to alcohol? Also, since we already used one campden tablet per gallon in the primary and will only be two or three weeks removed from that do we need to put more campden in when we do this? If so, should that also be at a rate of one per gallon?

Are there any negative reasons to pouring juice in and adding Sorbate this early? What about perhaps a 50/50 mixture of juice/water to make up for the lost volume? As said, we don’t mind watering down the alcohol content and sprucing up the raspberry flavor because we don’t want the alcohol over powering the taste of the wine.

The last batch prior to this with the 30+ pounds of pears and 6 pounds of white raisins came out great. We had adding probably a gallon or more of water to make up for lost volume in that batch and didn’t notice any loss of pear flavor because just like this batch we had gone heavy on the fruit.

Our main objective is to water down the alcohol flavor and perhaps spruce up the Raspberry flavor. Also, should we boil the juice and/or water before adding it?

Thanks for any advice and input!

 

[critterhunter]

Oh, and I know some of you might say pouring it through a funnel is the wrong way to do things but we did that with the first batch to (though using a mesh bag to strain it) several rackings because we were new to wine making and didn't know that on your second racking you should only siphone down to the sediment. Still, I guess this is what they call splash racking and from what I hear it's good to do the first racking or two to degass the wine. Our first batch came out great with no oxidation, and we didn't even use 1 campden tablet per gallon in the primary on that batch to prevent it.

That's other thing I'm curious about. If you splash rack the first time or two does that get rid of the need to de-gas your wine before bottling? We didn't de-gas our first batch.

 

[jdeere5220]

If you splash rack the first time or two does that get rid of the need to de-gas your wine before bottling? We didn't de-gas our first batch.

Critter- A little tip: Don't ask the same question in multiple threads. People may get annoyed because they answer in one place only to find the same question somewhere new. My recommendation would be to use one thread for all of your questions for this batch, so people can follow along.

Splash-racking is a technique people sometimes use to introduce air into the wine, if they think the yeast need a wake-up because they are oxygen deprived. I would not recommend this for your batch, especially since you have not told us your S.G. Regardless this is not a technique to replace degassing.

If you didn't degass your first batch, there are three possible outcomes that I am aware of:

1) The wine is gassy. Not the end of the world, but considered a fault for still wines and can effect the flavor and mouth-feel.

2) You allowed the wine to sit long enough before bottling that it degassed on its own (somehow I find this doubtful).

3) You got lucky and your yeast introduced very little gas into your wine.

 

[Julie]

Hi Critterhuner,

First off I would like to commend for your enthusiasm for making wine. I would like to make a suggestion. You need to do some reading. Your posts are extraordinary long, I am getting the idea that people are losing sight of what you are asking. Below is a link on how to make wine from beginning to end. Please read this and then post up specific questions. I know that you must love to read just by how long your posts are.

When you post a question you need to post the recipe and your procedure and the question on the specific issue that is going on with your wine. And please keep your questions to a specific wine in the same thread. There are usually several people who ask questions and when you post in separate threads the person who answers needs to search out your other threads so they can have a complete picture.

And above all else please take the advice that is given to you, I know several people have suggested you use a hydrometer but I believe that to date you have not. It gets very difficult to give advice when you do not take the advice that is given to you.

Here is the link and enjoy the reading, plus if you look under “Homemaker Tools” you will find a ton of useful information.

http://www.winebook.webs.com/winebook.pdf


Thank you.

 

[Teamsterjohn]

jdeere, I thought that I read on here that some people splash rack when they rack there wine a few times to help alone the de-gassing? There was even a picture posted of someone doing it. I guess that if you de-gass good enuff the first time, its not needed, but if you half *** in de-gasses, its ok do do that? Just asking to learn more.

 

[jdeere5220]

Hello Teamster,

Well it could be that splash-racking is recommended in other cases. I've only seen this term used in reference to trying to get a stuck fermentation restarted. This is one example:

http://www.winemakingtalk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=10493&highlight=splash+rack

 

[critterhunter]

Why even have a beginners forum if people are going to bash you for asking what may seem to them simple and basic questions. I get the feeling some people have different ideas about what a beginner forum is supposed to be used for. I thought it was for basic and yes what may seem even stupid questions to seasoned wine makers.

Part of the problem is that some people seem to have it in their mind that their way is the only way and everything else is wrong. For instance, yes, I have a hydrometer but my local wine supply store owner doesn't even use one. He highly recommends that we not even bother with one until we've made wine several times because there is enough to learn without taking that on as well. He actually is a big advocate of note using a hydrometer and keeping things more of an "art" rather than a "science". I have bought one, though, but I don't plan to use it until my next batch.

Another example of who's saying what and hearing the exact reverse elsewhere would be the splash racking thing. With our first batch we noticed a rotten egg smell from the breather. We were told to splash rack the wine the first few times we racked it by pouring it through a funnel into the carboy. We were told this would both remove the sulphur before it started effecting the taste of the wine, and that it would also help along the process of degassing it.

Well, that wine turned out wounderful. No oxidation, and we didn't even degass it before bottling. There is no hint of bubbles in it either. Not only that, but we didn't know what we were doing in that we were supposed to rack off the sediment and instead kept running/squeezing that through a mesh bag. As a result, the sediment kept coming along with each racking and we kept (by default) splash racking it. Now we know to rack off the sediment, but this second racking (first being from primary to secondary) we are going to need to try to get of the juice out of the excessive amount of sediment. That's going to involve some "splash racking" by default as well because of the process involved. We can siphon down to it but we've got to squeeze the rest a little to at least get some juice out of that.

With all the above said and done, nobody has yet to answer the question. Can we in say two weeks when we do the first carboy to carboy racking add sorbate then if we want to add more juice but don't want any more alchohol made from it? And, should we add campden if it's been less than three months since we did that (it'll be about 3 weeks since it was added in the primary).

 

[reefman]

CT,
That's what I call "seat-of-pants" wine making.
I've still not made my first successful batch.
When my first batch turned out bad, I stopped, and went back to reading everything I could find.
I am finally ready to try again, and I have collected all the basic equipment that most consider necessary, and I have read the material over and over again, to the point I can do this in my sleep probably.
I'll let you know how it turns out.
There's a lot of good and helpful people on this forum, so give them another chance. They are trying to understand the problem you are having, and want to give the best advise.
Keep us posted on your progress.