Mlf

[Gwand]

Following primary, I added culture to start MLF 5 days ago to 6 gallons of Montepulciano juice. PH was 3.30, S02 was 12 ppm and temp was 70. This is the first time I am trying MLF. I see tiny bubbles forming but not many. No bubbling in airlock. Do you think my culture is working? I was going to wait 4weeks before measuring malate levels.

 

[Pumpkinman]

Which MLB did you buy? The tiny bubbles are probably MLF.

 

[Gwand]

WLP675 Malolactic Culture. Came as a liquid. I brought to RT for 3 hours following directions and then pitched. Thanks Pumpkinman.

 

[Pumpkinman]

ah ha! lots of issues with this particular MLB, I'd wait a day or so, you wont be likely to see a violent fermentation or activity in the airlock as with the alcoholic fermentation, MLF is usually nice and easy. Your more likely to see more activity if the Carboy is in a room that is 70°.

 

[Gwand]

Will do. Thanks

 

[Boatboy24]

Is that the MLB that Harford was selling? I bought one tube, but am not sure I'm going to use it - I've heard sketchy reviews on the liquid MLB's. I'm going to kick off MLF on my Valpolicella this weekend and was tempted to just go with VP41.

 

[ShawnDTurner]

Those tiny bubbles are good indicators. I use wyeast 4007 with great results

 

[Gwand]

Boatboy. Yes that is the liquid culture from Harford. I wanted to use Lalvin Bacchus but could not get hold of it.

ShawnDTurner. Definitely have tiny bubbles but only about 25-50 at the surface. Of course the surface area is small becuase the carboy is near full. I was going to check malate level but I'm new at this so I may not trust my measurements.

Can anyone make a list of several of the MLF cultures with their pros and cons? Thanks.

 

[ShawnDTurner]

Your airlock will not bubble at all. This is a gentle conversion of malic to lactic. It can take up to 6 months so be patient. You will be rewarded

 

[Enologo]

Is it possible to do MLF without the testing. Say if one were to initiate it and then just bulk age for six months??

 

[ShawnDTurner]

Mlf could finish in 3 weeks depending on temps and nutrients. The problem with not testing is you are leaving yore wine vulnerable to infection. So if you leave it six months and your wine completed in 2 months. You increase your Chance of ruinning your wine.


Remember your so 2 levels are very low, plus leaving on dead yeast and bacteria can produce unwanted aroma and flavors.

Testing mlf is very easy

 

[Snafflebit]

Mlf could finish in 3 weeks depending on temps and nutrients. The problem with not testing is you are leaving yore wine vulnerable to infection. So if you leave it six months and your wine completed in 2 months. You increase your Chance of ruinning your wine.


Remember your so 2 levels are very low, plus leaving on dead yeast and bacteria can produce unwanted aroma and flavors.

Testing mlf is very easy

I had the same question. I will talk to the man at the brewery shop about MLF testing.

I have lots of little bubbles, at least!

This is what I used and appears to work well.
http://morewinemaking.com/products/dry-malolactic-bacteria-viniflora-ch16-15g.html

 

[Gwand]

Update. I measured malate levels before pitching bacteria and the level was 1500 mg/L. I measured malate levels again after 5 days and the level has not changed. Should I wait longer or re-pitch another strain of bacteria? Thanks all.

 

[cmason1957]

Wait longer to test again. I never even bother to test until at least a month has passed. MLF is not like yeast fermentation. It is gentle, slow, and then slower. If you see any kind of bubbles, it is working and might be even if you don't see bubbles.

 

[harmony24]

At what point do you stop mlf? How do you know it's finished? How often do you check? I just pitched the liquid form myself. Don't have a way to check yet. I'm a little nervous about the whole thing. Any help would be great.

 

[ShawnDTurner]

Harmony I take the first Chrono Test at 4 weeks, then based on the results. I either test sooner or give it a longer time before I test.

 

[geek]

Wait longer to test again. I never even bother to test until at least a month has passed. MLF is not like yeast fermentation. It is gentle, slow, and then slower. If you see any kind of bubbles, it is working and might be even if you don't see bubbles.

ditto.

When I first tried the process I was almost crying out loud for help but then realized you may not see much activity really; it happened to both my malbec and cab sav juice from Chile using lalvin bacchus and they both finally completed.

I now put a merlot batch over a month ago using the white labs one mentioned by the OP, small activity as well but more at the begining and it seems like it has slowed down but the room temp also decreased from the 70s to the 60s.

I turned on the heat in the basement and the temp is now 70; this would help.

I learned that patience is key with mlf.

 

[petey]

Mlf could finish in 3 weeks depending on temps and nutrients. The problem with not testing is you are leaving yore wine vulnerable to infection. So if you leave it six months and your wine completed in 2 months. You increase your Chance of ruinning your wine.

Remember your so 2 levels are very low, plus leaving on dead yeast and bacteria can produce unwanted aroma and flavors.

Testing mlf is very easy

It sure doesn't sound easy Norris it inexpensive

 

[Pumpkinman]

Don't over think the MLF process, this is the biggest problem, it is as simple as pitching yeast for Alcoholic fermentation, you need to know your PH, TA and SO2 levels, but most of us test for this as soon as we get a juice bucket, or right after (within 24 hrs) crushing, with this info, you will know if you need to make any adjustments (the same as prior to pitching your yeast, you should make all corrections before you pitch the yeast).
The variety of MLB that you will select will tell you its tolerances, based upon that, you make the corrections and pitch, fairly simple no?
I don't know what get's everyone all choked up about MLF, the moment it is mentioned sheer panic and hysteria breaks out, many people think that they will see a violent full blown fermentation going on...this isn't the case, most times, MLF is very calm, you may see activity in the airlock, most times not, there is absolutely no reason to check for MLF daily, you are going to drive yourself crazy.
Purchase a reliable MLB, Lalvin puts out Bacchus (the most cost effective for small batches) I prefer to use Lalvin 31 and MBR 41, do they cost more? You betcha! But you get what you pay for, most LHBS either do not carry a MLB or they'll carry White Labs in the tubes because it is cheap, heck, I have yet to find a LHBS that can tell me more than "MLF will change the acid in your wine" about MLF.
I've had MLF take 2-3 months, and I've had it take a few weeks when I had the heat in my office cranked up, I prefer to let it go at its own pace, make sure that you get Opti-Malo and if your budget allows, Acti-ML, these will give your MLF much more probability for success. The one thing that MLF isn't, is inexpensive, but, you will reap the rewards when you taste the difference!
Check out this article that I put together about MLF based upon a lot of data that can be found on line

 

[Snafflebit]

The one thing that MLF isn't, is inexpensive, but, you will reap the rewards when you taste the difference!
Check out this article that I put together about MLF based upon a lot of data that can be found on line

The Viniflora CH16 I bought was about $20 so it will add $1 to the bottle of Cab Sauv I am making.

you need to know your PH, TA and SO2 levels, but most of us test for this as soon as we get a juice bucket, or right after (within 24 hrs) crushing, with this info, you will know if you need to make any adjustments

I hesitated to do MLF because my pH is 4.0 but I had two professional winemakers tell me that regardless, MLF is going to happen to their reds so I should do it. The bacteria is everywhere on their equipment and they agreed that pH 4.0 is not ideal but the flavor will be better.