Total Acid Question

[Billberry]

I'm starting to get comfortable with the wine making procedure and I'm ready to start making different types of wine. I'm going to try various fruit wines for now and I was wondering if there is any hard fast rule of where a fruit's total acid should be at before fermenting? Does it vary from fruit to fruit or is it dependent on personal taste? Is there a thread somewhere that goes over this point or some sort of a TA table for wines?
I haven't had enough experience at tasting different types of wine to know if one is too flat or too acidic so using personal taste might make me a better judge of such things but might also cost me a bunch of ruined batches plus the time and money I have put into a stinker!
Until I get quite a few batches under my belt I like to lean on all of you experienced wine makers for guidance and I appreciate all of the advice I can get.
Bill

 

[RegionRat]

Here is something to read


And Here

RR

 

[JohnT]

If you are talking a fruit wine and TA, anywhere within the range of .70 and .80 should be perfect... I like a little more acid in fruit wines.

 

[Billberry]

Thanks for the links RR. I remember reading the one from Jack Keller's site a long time ago and I might as well have been reading Greek at the time lol. It makes a little more sense now. What wine do you pair up with perogies at the fest in the summer? ( I used to live in Hammond and loved the Perogi fest in Whiting)
I'll keep your numbers in mind when I start my peach John. I should probably invest in a decent PH meter too since I plan on going "all in" with my wine making. From what I've read it makes checking TA easier with dark colored wines over a titration kit.

Bill

 

[GreginND]

If you are talking a fruit wine and TA, anywhere within the range of .70 and .80 should be perfect... I like a little more acid in fruit wines.

John, is this recommendation based on fruit wines typically being sweetened? I haven't done the experiments but I'm wondering if anyone has experience with TA on various dry fruit wines.

 

[RegionRat]

Thanks for the links RR. I remember reading the one from Jack Keller's site a long time ago and I might as well have been reading Greek at the time lol. It makes a little more sense now. What wine do you pair up with perogies at the fest in the summer? ( I used to live in Hammond and loved the Perogi fest in Whiting)
I'll keep your numbers in mind when I start my peach John. I should probably invest in a decent PH meter too since I plan on going "all in" with my wine making. From what I've read it makes checking TA easier with dark colored wines over a titration kit.

Bill

Ah, Pierogie Fest, what a great time. This year I took 3gal of BD in an Igloo cooler and passed glasses of it out during the Parade.

RR

 

[jpcedotal]

ok, so there are two types of acid measurements that need to be taken?

TA and Ph?

When do I do each? I bought a TA kit but I don't have a Ph testing kit. Surely I can find one in this country town somewhere...

 

[Deezil]

John, is this recommendation based on fruit wines typically being sweetened? I haven't done the experiments but I'm wondering if anyone has experience with TA on various dry fruit wines.

I could measure the TA in my MLF'd Apple-Pear, it's "spot on" for me

 

[Billberry]

ok, so there are two types of acid measurements that need to be taken?

TA and Ph?

When do I do each? I bought a TA kit but I don't have a Ph testing kit. Surely I can find one in this country town somewhere...

From what I understand TA is the quantity of acid in a wine while PH is the strength of the acid in a wine. I just bought some cheap pH strips from my LHBS until I can get a decent PH meter.
I think both need to be checked and adjusted before starting the fermentation process.

Bill

 

[JohnT]

John, is this recommendation based on fruit wines typically being sweetened? I haven't done the experiments but I'm wondering if anyone has experience with TA on various dry fruit wines.

Sorry for the late response.

This is what I shoot for on all my fruit wines. Like you, I like my wines dry.

 

[JohnT]

From what I understand TA is the quantity of acid in a wine while PH is the strength of the acid in a wine. I just bought some cheap pH strips from my LHBS until I can get a decent PH meter.
I think both need to be checked and adjusted before starting the fermentation process.

Bill

Bill,

You pretty much got that right. TA is the WEIGHT of acid and typically is shown in the form of Grams per Liter (G/L). This is why I suggest taking a liter of distilled water, add 1/2 gram of acid, then test. I believe this should register as .5g/l.

PH is the measure of free ions, or the strength of the total acid in your sample. The two numbers should show a trend, but not always agree. The hardest bit to get my pea sized brain around is the HIGHER the PH, the lower the strength of acid. A PH of 7 is neutral.

If, for a red wine, you shoot for a .65 g/l ta, and a 3.4 ph, there may be times where the TA is low, while the PH is also low, but most of the time the numbers will be rather close.

My advice is this.. Don't bother with those strips. I Find that they are not accurate enough to rely on. Keep using the TA kit and rethink the purchase of a PH meter.

 

[GreginND]

The hardest bit to get my pea sized brain around is the HIGHER the PH, the lower the strength of acid. A PH of 0 is neutral.

Typo? A pH of 0 is very acidic. Neutral is pH 7.

 

[JohnT]

Typo? A pH of 0 is very acidic. Neutral is pH 7.

Sorry, Yes it is a typo. PH scale goes from 0 to 14 with 7.0 being neutral...

My bad!

johnT

 

[jpcedotal]

so no strips, get the meter....what is the best meter for the buck?