Tannin Riche taste

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kuziwk

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Hi guys, I've read alot about tannin Riche. I'm concerned it would impart too much oak as I already use 100g of chips typically included in the kit in the primary and 50G oak cubes for 3 months when aging, and I prefer the oak flavor to come from actually oak rather than a tannin powder. At the current moment I'm using grape tannin which is powdered and comes from the skins and stems (generic wine kitz supply brand). When tasted by itself in a bit of water its a bit earthy, astringent and bitter. So far so good i just don't add too much as I would imagine it would make the wine taste too bitter where I'm looking for structure and astringency. I usually add 1-2 tsp while bulk aging for cheap wines, lately though I've been adding it during fermentation as I heard it integrates better and only 5-15% are really only sacrificial or drop out. However, on the bigger kits I've only just started adding 1tsp while bulk aging so I can taste how the addition affected the wine. Prior to this I just followed the instructions for premium kits, where now I feel that they could use a touch more tannin. Are the Scotts labs tannins any better than what I'm using now? Are they more astringent and less bitter? Do they have any tannins that are neutral and don't add additional oak flavors? Also not sure if it's just me, but I notice that the high end kits seem to be more astringent 1 year later as opposed to when it was young just after clearing...this makes it hard to judge how much tannin to add. Perhaps the young fruit flavor that fades with time masks the tannins and astringency?
 
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Yes, and yes.

When I taste generic tannins, I can't spit it out fast enough. When I taste Tannin Riche, I pucker and smile, and enjoy the flavor notes.

So you're using tannin Riche? Does it have alot of oak, as im not looking to add too much more oak flavor. How is the tannin complex they sell? seems to be cheaper.
 
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It isn't oaky at all. At least not to my taste.
You guys think I can get away with their tannin complex? Seems more nuetral...and it's cheaper. I'm pretty sure the tannin powder I have is chesnut extract even though it says "comes from skins and stems"...I think they are explaing where most tannins come from rather than what the actual product is.
 
I agree with Jim in tannin additions even though many are a product of oak and other exotic woods do not give any oak flavor. Tannin Riche is derived from French Oak and Tannin Riche Extra from American. My preference is Tannin Estate which I'll a lot of times combine with Complex. I always use FT Rouge during fermentation which is chestnut.
 
I agree with Jim in tannin additions even though many are a product of oak and other exotic woods do not give any oak flavor. Tannin Riche is derived from French Oak and Tannin Riche Extra from American. My preference is Tannin Estate which I'll a lot of times combine with Complex. I always use FT Rouge during fermentation which is chestnut.
So for all intents and purposes I basically already have rouge (chesnut) but the wine kitz brand...it can't be that bad. I just think alot of their products are overpriced for what they are but it's specialized and not too many other offer it so they get away with it. I might pickup some complex from them to to see what the fuss is about. I can't bring myself to spend money on tannin Riche yet.
 
I could be missing something but if you're looking at Scott Labs they only sell large volumes. There are several other sites that sell these products for the home winemaker in smaller, more affordable quantities.
The only one I know of is bosagrape in Canada...we get screwed over on alot of products
 
@sour_grapes you tasted the tannin Riche by itself, have you tried their tannin complex by itself? I just bought a 1kg bag of tannin complex so I hope it's fine, I'll get my finishing tannins and flavor from the oak cubes I use.
 
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I've played around with tannin in the past, mostly while making wine from central valley grapes. Tannin is much like other wine adjustments, it requires some experience, as it's not easy to determine by the initial tasting what the end result will be. A finishing tannin is less reactive and may be more forgiving, maybe you can tell what's going on after a few days or weeks. Fermentation and cellaring tannins are very reactive and often give a negative initial impression, and can take months to react before you can taste and determine if you like the result or not. If you're bulk aging for 1 to 2 years, split the batch and experiment, make small additions and take it slow, taste along the way, you've got time on your side.
 
I've used generic tannins and the Scott Labs ones. I like the Scott ones better because they have a nice complexity and subtle taste. I layer them in with oak and it adds a lot to my batches.
How much do you typically add? I'm wondering if I can use the tannin complex instead of rouge during fermentetion, as I only bought the one.
 
The recommended dosage rates for a fermentation tannin like Rouge and a finishing tannin like Riche are very different, like a factor of 5 if memory serves.
 
The recommended dosage rates for a fermentation tannin like Rouge and a finishing tannin like Riche are very different, like a factor of 5 if memory serves.
Fair enough, Im waiting for the tannin complex to arrive and I will add a bit as I have a bunch of batches aging. I don't want to overdo it though, im on a bodybuilding keto diet right now lol so wine is all tasting a bit sweet and not very tannic...even green pepper taste sweet so maybe is not the best time to be tasting and adding tannin.
 
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