Fermenation going too quickly ???

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tdawg

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Hi, I started my first batch wine from crushed Syrah grape at 3pm on Sunday with a brix of 25. I checked brix again last night ( tuesday) around 7pm and it was 4.5 ?? !! it only was about 52 hours of fermentation.
I thought brix should only have gone down to 18 at this point. The must was hot 84-86 degrees, but has cooled down to 79 degrees this AM> I guess I will start maloactic now I planned on doing when Brix hit 17 or so, but that passed so quickly didn't realize. I added some yeast nutrient last night as well to ensure the yeast finishes it job hopefully.

Is this a potential problem that fermentation went so quick ???


Thanks,
Trent
 
Welcome aboard!!

With temps that warm - I am not too surprised it went that quick. For a red - try to keep the temps around 70*.
 
Hi, I started my first batch wine from crushed Syrah grape at 3pm on Sunday with a brix of 25. I checked brix again last night ( tuesday) around 7pm and it was 4.5 ?? !! it only was about 52 hours of fermentation.
I thought brix should only have gone down to 18 at this point. The must was hot 84-86 degrees, but has cooled down to 79 degrees this AM> I guess I will start maloactic now I planned on doing when Brix hit 17 or so, but that passed so quickly didn't realize. I added some yeast nutrient last night as well to ensure the yeast finishes it job hopefully.

Is this a potential problem that fermentation went so quick ???


Thanks,
Trent

That's pretty fast! However, Brix can drop 10 points a day.

Just something to consider:

With what device are you checking Brix?

If you are trying to use a refractometer, once the must has started producing alcohol, checking Brix with a refractometer is not directly applicable anymore. The alcohol WILL distort the reading. You have to go through a special conversion chart to get a good result. Or, you have to use a hydrometer.
 
Same Here

I'm experiencing similar results. My 12 gallons of Cab sauv was crushed Saturday and yeasted Sunday. My inital SG was 1.093. This morning it is down to 1.020. I have my fermenter in the basement/garage. Must temp has been about 73 degrees. I'll continue to watch the SG. I'm sure there are products that can be added to enhance the deep/dark color in red wine. I've not added any of this. I figure extended contact of the skins in the wine will improve wine color as well. With faster fermentation, color may be sacraficed.

Those of you who have passed this way before, how long is it safe to keep the must in the primary after SG is = or < then 1.000?

Thanks,

Paul
 
I'm experiencing similar results. My 12 gallons of Cab sauv was crushed Saturday and yeasted Sunday. My inital SG was 1.093. This morning it is down to 1.020. I have my fermenter in the basement/garage. Must temp has been about 73 degrees. I'll continue to watch the SG. I'm sure there are products that can be added to enhance the deep/dark color in red wine. I've not added any of this. I figure extended contact of the skins in the wine will improve wine color as well. With faster fermentation, color may be sacraficed.

Those of you who have passed this way before, how long is it safe to keep the must in the primary after SG is = or < then 1.000?

Thanks,

Paul

Actually, a little higher temperature will help extract more of the color and other goodies out of the skins. Don't be afraid to let the must temperature get into the upper 80's F, especially for a heavier wine like a cab.

Just make sure you don't let the internal temperature of the must get over the normal temperature range of the yeast. Otherwise, the yeast can all die.

The reason you want to take the skins off the must are several. One, especially for a cab, is to limit the amount of different tannins, which gets extracted into the wine. Highly experienced wine makers (not me!!!) can taste the must daily to decide just when to press off the skins. Sometimes they will press them off at a much higher SG, maybe even 1.040.

Another reason is that there are two oxygen-related stages of fermentation. The first stage requires oxygen to be present for the yeast; the second stage wants no oxygen at all.

So, at your recommended pressing point, access to more tannins is removed and you put your wine in a sealed container, under air lock, so oxygen access is very limited.

So, if you leave the wine on the skins longer (below 1.000) and in the primary, where oxygen is available, you negate the above, risking too much tannin and oxidation.

Hope this helps.
 
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That's pretty fast! However, Brix can drop 10 points a day.

Just something to consider:

With what device are you checking Brix?

If you are trying to use a refractometer, once the must has started producing alcohol, checking Brix with a refractometer is not directly applicable anymore. The alcohol WILL distort the reading. You have to go through a special conversion chart to get a good result. Or, you have to use a hydrometer.

I am using a hydrometer and checking my measurements many times. It was hard for me to believe my eyes, I woke up at midnight as i couldnt sleep thinking about it and tested it again, same result 4.5 brix. crazy. glad to hear its OK!
 
I'm experiencing similar results. My 12 gallons of Cab sauv was crushed Saturday and yeasted Sunday. My inital SG was 1.093. This morning it is down to 1.020. I have my fermenter in the basement/garage. Must temp has been about 73 degrees. I'll continue to watch the SG. I'm sure there are products that can be added to enhance the deep/dark color in red wine. I've not added any of this. I figure extended contact of the skins in the wine will improve wine color as well. With faster fermentation, color may be sacraficed.

Those of you who have passed this way before, how long is it safe to keep the must in the primary after SG is = or < then 1.000?

Thanks,

Paul


Hello Paul,

Last year we did Merlot and Cabernet Sauvignon. We picked up one batch about a week after the other so their primary fermentations were a bit staggered. Anyway, to answer your question, the Merlot grapes remained in the primary for 4 weeks and it was reading 0.996 Brix 6 days before pressing. Remember there will be a blanket of CO2 emitted from fermentation and so long as you don't mix it up too and allow ambient air to become exposed to the must, you should be fine.

Once primary was done, there was less of a defined cap on the must. I still wanted to punch down to get the skins in contact with more of the must but when I did, I did so very slowly in an attempt to keep the CO2 atmosphere above the must as undisturbed as possible. One aspect of our setup that was beneficial was the amount of head space in the primary. I would estimate there was 12-18 inches of wall from the top of the must to the top of the fermenter; this allowed a large amount of CO2 to accumulate. One gentleman did recommend the option of using food grade argon but I decided not to go that route.

-Jenks
 
Hello Paul,

Last year we did Merlot and Cabernet Sauvignon. We picked up one batch about a week after the other so their primary fermentations were a bit staggered. Anyway, to answer your question, the Merlot grapes remained in the primary for 4 weeks and it was reading 0.996 Brix 6 days before pressing. Remember there will be a blanket of CO2 emitted from fermentation and so long as you don't mix it up too and allow ambient air to become exposed to the must, you should be fine.

Once primary was done, there was less of a defined cap on the must. I still wanted to punch down to get the skins in contact with more of the must but when I did, I did so very slowly in an attempt to keep the CO2 atmosphere above the must as undisturbed as possible. One aspect of our setup that was beneficial was the amount of head space in the primary. I would estimate there was 12-18 inches of wall from the top of the must to the top of the fermenter; this allowed a large amount of CO2 to accumulate. One gentleman did recommend the option of using food grade argon but I decided not to go that route.

-Jenks

I am trying to understand what you did.
Wine was completely dry 6 days before you pressed, so basically, you did a 6 day extended maceration. Right? In other words, for all but the last 6 days, the wine was still fermenting. Still right?

So if the wine was in primary for 4 weeks, that means it took about 3 weeks to ferment to dry, if I am understanding you. That is a pretty long period of time to go dry. What yeast were you using and what was the temperature of the must during most of that 3 weeks?

Right now I am doing a rose from fresh Zin grapes with D47 yeast at a maximum temperature of about 70F, which is a little higher than I want. Even at that, the SG is dropping like crazy. 70F is as low as I can realistically keep the temperature or fermentation would go a little slower.

Like you said, if you kept the container closed and didn't overly agitate the must, there would still be a good amount of CO2 left even after 6 days of maceration. Wine with all the skins after fermentation would be saturated with CO2, even when pushing down the cap. The key is keeping the container closed whenever possible.

That's where a little dry ice can help. You can put small pieces on top of the must; it won't change the temperature of the must by much; but it will produce nice amounts of CO2 for protection.

In Paul's case, I would not recommend him to try an extended maceration his first time. He needs to get through a complete cycle before he tries something like that. Especially since he doesn't really know the tannic structure of the grapes. It will give him something new to try next time.
 
Check my BRIX again last night. I was down to 1. This is after about 77 hours. The temperature was down to 74, I could still see some light fermentation happening.

Seems ok right?
 
Check my BRIX again last night. I was down to 1. This is after about 77 hours. The temperature was down to 74, I could still see some light fermentation happening.

Seems ok right?

Temperature drops as fermentation starts slowing. Yes, you are fine. Since you are using a hydrometer, one thing I would recommend is to give us SG values and not just brix. The reason is that the wine can very easily and likely will go below 0 brix. The SG readings go a little lower and allow you to monitor dryness a little longer. No matter how low the SG reading gets, the wine is not finished until the SG does not drop for 3 days in a row.
 
Check my BRIX again last night. I was down to 1. This is after about 77 hours. The temperature was down to 74, I could still see some light fermentation happening.

Seems ok right?

I agree with Robie - SG values mean a bit more when measuring dryness and fermentation.

77 hours isn't bad - I have had wines go 2 weeks fermenting.
 
Yeast was D254 i believe, I added just the amount as recommended. Brix still at 1 tonight I think SG was 1.005 ? That make sense?
 

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