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joeswine

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DPCellars, send one . I'll give you an in-depth breakdown pro's and cons of you pino.
 

joeswine

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Post a picture of your metal's that's an important achievement ,trust me it will help your mentability moving forward with your skills.
 

joeswine

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It all depends on the judge's ability and with their qualifications are but if you send that same one to different contests and get different results then it's up to you to decipher quality of your workmanship, I've been doing competition for years and got metals from across this country gold and gold so I know what I'm talking about but what it does to it helps you believe in your product and helps you correct your product.
 

joeswine

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You should Post your's also be proud of what you make ,let others know so that they can take another step in the process.understand?
A win is a win 👍 Mainshipfred
 

DPCellars

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But were they consistent? I only entered one competition and the comments went from "you should go commercial" to "you should give up your hobby" for the same wine, exaggerating of course.
For two of the wines I entered the comments were fairly consistent. A third, which I expected a great deal of harsh criticism on, the comments were all over the place.
 

DPCellars

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DPCellars, send one . I'll give you an in-depth breakdown pro's and cons of you pino.
I would love to, but I make so little there's hardly any left. However, when my 2020 is ready (made more this year), I will reach out. I appreciate it.
 

DPCellars

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You should Post your's also be proud of what you make ,let others know so that they can take another step in the process.understand?
A win is a win 👍 Mainshipfred
Don't laugh... I'm a Donkey lacking opposable thumbs. I'm just happy they made the medal in my size 🤣PXL_20200912_023125188.jpgPXL_20200912_023125188.jpg
 

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joeswine

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Always respect your work and be proud of your achievements .
 

joeswine

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Since I've moved up to windows 10,l haven't figured out how to add pics and text yet.
 

DonnyDarko19

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So I'm interested in entering some wine into the winemakers magazine competition this year. I have a wine (my second ever from fresh grapes) that is good, but not amazing. But I don't need to pay judges to tell me that. Instead, I would really like to receive constructive feedback that will help me improve my craft.

For people who have entered their wines in this competition, did the judges provide recommendations on things to consider to improve your process? Or did they just provide notes on what the liked and didn't like about your wines? Like I said, I'm hoping to get more than just a judges thoughts on my wines and would really like recommendation on how to improve future wines.
 

BernardSmith

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Hi DonkeyDarko19, That's a good question and you may want to begin a thread with it rather than attach it to a discussion that is about 10.5 years old...
But my quick thought is that judges have no good sense of your protocol or process. All they can observe is how your wine tastes, smells and looks and they can point to flaws they identify and make suggestions for the alleviation of those flaws. How the flaws may have been produced is not something, in my experience, they can mention. So, for example, one date wine I submitted to a national competition was penalized because judges detected a saline taste (salt). The taste may have come from the dates themselves or may have come from some other source, but the judges were not looking over my shoulder as I made this wine, so they could not say what I might have done to avoid the taste of salt: as it happens, according to the literature, dates can have a detectable taste of salt depending on how and where they were grown...
Different competitions may use different scoring sheets but basically they are going to look for
Absence or presence of faults (sulfur; oxidation; VA; cloudiness/sediment; inappropriate effervescence
Appearance (clarity and color)
Aroma (how well developed and the kinds of aromas detected)
Balance (acids; tannins; perceived sweetness)
Body (mouthfeel)
Taste (fruity; vegetative; chemical)
Finish (how well do the flavors linger in your mouth)
Overall quality

Each category will have different points assigned: some may have 5 points max, others 2 and you are likely to be judged by three judges each one who prepares a (usually) handwritten score sheet. They may simply give you a score for each category and a final score and they may write up comments such as "Bright and Attractive" or "Balance is off due to.. " or "well crafted" etc
 

mainshipfred

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Bernard pretty much hit it on the head. The only thing I might add is you will probably get different scores or comments from the different judges. So you have to pick which ones you want to take with a grain of salt.
 

joeswine

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Actually one of the judges on my port stated that he didn't really liked coffee but this one was excellent and that's not the first time i received that same statement on that same port and took best of shoe a tCellarmasters go figure so when i say its all subjective it is ,but a win is a win.
 

DonnyDarko19

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Hi DonkeyDarko19, That's a good question and you may want to begin a thread with it rather than attach it to a discussion that is about 10.5 years old...
But my quick thought is that judges have no good sense of your protocol or process. All they can observe is how your wine tastes, smells and looks and they can point to flaws they identify and make suggestions for the alleviation of those flaws. How the flaws may have been produced is not something, in my experience, they can mention. So, for example, one date wine I submitted to a national competition was penalized because judges detected a saline taste (salt). The taste may have come from the dates themselves or may have come from some other source, but the judges were not looking over my shoulder as I made this wine, so they could not say what I might have done to avoid the taste of salt: as it happens, according to the literature, dates can have a detectable taste of salt depending on how and where they were grown...
Different competitions may use different scoring sheets but basically they are going to look for
Absence or presence of faults (sulfur; oxidation; VA; cloudiness/sediment; inappropriate effervescence
Appearance (clarity and color)
Aroma (how well developed and the kinds of aromas detected)
Balance (acids; tannins; perceived sweetness)
Body (mouthfeel)
Taste (fruity; vegetative; chemical)
Finish (how well do the flavors linger in your mouth)
Overall quality

Each category will have different points assigned: some may have 5 points max, others 2 and you are likely to be judged by three judges each one who prepares a (usually) handwritten score sheet. They may simply give you a score for each category and a final score and they may write up comments such as "Bright and Attractive" or "Balance is off due to.. " or "well crafted" etc
Thanks, @BernardSmith and @mainshipfred
Thats pretty much what I assumed. I guess I'll just have to do my best to decipher any feedback and try to figure out how best to improve or correct the process.
 

BernardSmith

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The judges' comments may suggest solutions to flaws but insofar as they have no idea what your processes might involve they will focus (if on anything) on ways to reduce or remove flaws but those ways don't speak to what you may or may not be doing - So, for example, if they detect evidence of oxidation they will point that fact out. How (and when) you then reduce your wine's exposure to O2 is not something that they may be able to tell you because the exposure may be caused at many points none of which they will know. A better source for trying to improve your processes may be a wine making or beer brewing club in your area. There there are opportunities to share bottles and to discuss processes with others who make similar wines (or beers) and members typically enjoy helping one another improve their wine making/brewing practices...
 

winemaker81

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Not all judges are honestly qualified to judge a competition. Plus not everyone is good at giving feedback, and differences in opinion can produce contrary feedback.

I was a preliminary judge at the home wine makers competition at the NY State Fair for several years in the 90's. The judges were mostly home wine makers and mostly members of various chapters of the American Wine Society, so presumably all had experience in wine judging. We were given guidelines for judging. One was that we could not give a wine a low score because of sulfite smell. One year, the guy sitting next to me hated sulfite, so he ignored the rules and nuked (lowballed) the score on every wine where he could get even a whiff of sulfite. That was not cool. AFAIK, he was not asked back the following year.

Plus some folks can't judge wines they don't like, e.g., dry wine drinker judging semi-sweet wines. Or the reverse. Or white vs. red, or ...

Duration of the judging is another factor. Each year I tasted ~70 wines during a 3 or 4 hour period. Sniff, taste, & spit. Sample half a cracker to clear the palate and ready myself for the next sample. With a few exceptions, it was a lot of fun although I overdid my yearly allotment for crackers.

During the tasting, the folks at my table set aside the half dozen really good bottles, as we intended to have a glass after the judging was over. At that time I realized 2 things:

1) I was lit (lightly drunk). Even without swallowing wine, I got enough in me after tasting 70 wines to affect me. I didn't realize it until I stood up at the end. [Yes, it was amusing, and no, I was not the only one affected.]

2) When I actually had a half glass of wine, I couldn't enjoy it. My taste buds were badly overwhelmed. This made me wonder how fair I was to the last dozen or so wines. Until I stopped judging, I felt fine. It was when I tried to enjoy a glass that I realized the situation.

It was good that I was riding with family, as driving was not a good idea ... plus we wandered around the Fair for another 3 hours, which sobered me up. My tastebuds took a week to recover.

It was a good experience, overall most of the wines were at least "good". On the flip side, I recall a wine I didn't taste. I sniffed a wine, nearly gagged, and there was NO way I was putting that in my mouth. Not sure I'd chance damaging my sink with it. That wine produced the longest discussion, as we couldn't figure out what the maker did wrong. It made a badly oxidized wine smell good.
 
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