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Wanted To Post About My Mystery Grape!

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CK55

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I Figured I would post about the grapes that im getting Dna tested by UC Davis since nobody in the family remembers what they are, They have been on the property where I live for 40 years and came from cuttings from the original vine in Angels Camp,California which was planted sometime between 1870 and 1910. Im pretty excited to find out what they are, as I sent Mike at Carlisle winery a bunch of photos and he was stumped by it as well.

Im open to everyone taking a guess and we will see what it comes back as, tell you what you can all do one guess each and whoever is right will get a free kit from me. I thought I would spice it up for you guys.
 

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CK55

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Please post back later. How many inches of rain per year do you average? What is Angels Camp?
i have no idea what that has to do with it, the grapes are currently planted on my property in san luis obispo county, and i didnt ask what you thought about that, i wanted you to guess what varietal you think it is.
 

salcoco

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try mission grape? my guess is based on dates you mentioned. it would be the time the missionaries would have been in CA.
 

Masbustelo

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I apologize for having expressed interest in the post and having solicited information that may be relevant to both the horticulture and historic origins of these plants. Perhaps this could be a variant of Grenache?
 

CK55

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I apologize for having expressed interest in the post and having solicited information that may be relevant to both the horticulture and historic origins of these plants. Perhaps this could be a variant of Grenache?
I mean it could be but it is growing in sand, my property is basically the only one in the area on top of a giant ancient sand dune. And according to research Grenache does not grow well in sand. So i think it wouldnt really fit.

try mission grape? my guess is based on dates you mentioned. it would be the time the missionaries would have been in CA.
I don't think its mission as their arent any missions around where it was planted. And mike didn't as well.I was told that the family did have a preference for French wine grapes, the only grape we know for a fact they had planted was Alicante Bouschet. The others are as stated why this one is being tested. The family was Italian and was here as early as 1850, so what we have thought as a possible story is that cuttings were taken from vines planted in the 1850's and moved onto the new property which was built in the 1870's. So it could even be older I have no idea. DNA Testing might solve that mystery, but whatever it is survived the phylloxera epidemic in Europe and survived contracting it here. So it might be something that's quite uncommon even rare today.
 
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salcoco

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I will try Zinfandel or Primitivo or even its original Hungarian name which I cannot spell at the moment.
 

CK55

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I will try Zinfandel or Primitivo or even its original Hungarian name which I cannot spell at the moment.
Yeah, that i do know of, ive been reading up like a mad man on like 2000 different varieties of grapes since getting into wine making. I will have the results in 1-3 weeks. So keep posting guys :).
 

treesaver

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Hate to say it, but looks like a concord to me! I know that isn't what you want to hear!
 

CK55

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Hate to say it, but looks like a concord to me! I know that isn't what you want to hear!
It cant be because we know for a fact that the only table grape planted by the family was a white grape. They hated Concord. A lot. My Grandmother told me years back that the grapes were still on the property in the 30's and that she remembers that they did have alicante bouschet and a white table grape along with all of the others, so we are keen to figure out the origin of this grape.

When i say still on the property i meant the original one where the grapes were possibly cuttings from.
 
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Zintrigue

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Angels Camp is right around the corner from me. Unfortunately, that doesn't help me identify because they grow all varieties there! (Calaveras county is like a mini Napa, for anyone looking for off the beaten path wine haven - check out Murphys!).

I will say that the 49ers were big on the Zinfandel they brought with them to the area, hence the heavy selling of "old growth" zins around here. My fave. And I know for a fact that Zin grows like a weed in these hills, I was told by a local vineyard that you could pee on it and it would give you great grapes.

But still, Cabs and Barberas and Tempranillos and Syrahs are big hitters here, too. /shrug

I guess I'll throw my hand in the pot for a Syrah, but my second guess would be Zin. Can't wait to hear the results!
 

CK55

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Angels Camp is right around the corner from me. Unfortunately, that doesn't help me identify because they grow all varieties there! (Calaveras county is like a mini Napa, for anyone looking for off the beaten path wine haven - check out Murphys!).

I will say that the 49ers were big on the Zinfandel they brought with them to the area, hence the heavy selling of "old growth" zins around here. My fave. And I know for a fact that Zin grows like a weed in these hills, I was told by a local vineyard that you could pee on it and it would give you great grapes.

But still, Cabs and Barberas and Tempranillos and Syrahs are big hitters here, too. /shrug

I guess I'll throw my hand in the pot for a Syrah, but my second guess would be Zin. Can't wait to hear the results!
It grows like a bat out of hell, nobody took care of it or watered it or even pruned it for 2+ decades and it survived an extensive over 10-year drought. So whatever it is is highly tolerant of drought and disease as its completely disease free and is growing in pure sand. So Im eager to find out what the heck frows like a bat out of hell on sandy soil. This year i watered it and corrected a slight nutrient deficiency pointed out to me by Mike At Carlisle Winery and now its healthy and got a lot of clusters of grapes growing on it. I intend to make a small batch of wine out of all the grapes it makes me And see what 40+-year-old vines make. Since i was told that its considered an old vine at this point.
 

balatonwine

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i have no idea what that has to do with it, the grapes are currently planted on my property in san luis obispo county, and i didnt ask what you thought about that, i wanted you to guess what varietal you think it is.
Different grape varieties differ in their water needs. Some are more drought tolerant than others. So if you really wanted help in people trying to determine the variety, the more information you can provide about your local climate and geographical conditions (soil et al.), planting method (grafted (if growing in sand, probably not needed) or not , et al.) the better. If you just wanted to have a "contest" based on some photos, that is of course a different game. ;)
 
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balatonwine

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And according to research Grenache does not grow well in sand. So i think it wouldnt really fit.
Well, to be frank, I don't consider the vines in the photos "growing well". But they also seem to have been neglected. Maybe you have some more up to date photos of better, current growth?
 

balatonwine

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I will try Zinfandel or Primitivo or even its original Hungarian name which I cannot spell at the moment.
I would also lean toward Zinfandel at the moment without more info. But would not hang my hat on that guess (because it is just a guess -- would like more verified info on the claimed source of the cuttings). By the way, the origin of Zinfandel is now considered to be the Croatia grape "Crljenak Kaštelanski"

But in the end, the DNA should solve it.
 

CK55

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Different grape varieties differ in their water needs. Some are more drought tolerant than others. So if you really wanted help in people trying to determine the variety, the more information you can provide about your local climate and geographical conditions (soil et al.), planting method (grafted (if growing in sand, probably not needed) or not , et al.) the better. If you just wanted to have a "contest" based on some photos, that is of course a different game. ;)
I live in San Luis Obispo county look up the Arroyo Grande AVA that's where I am. My vines are in soil comprised of ancient sand dunes. These vines are original rootstock. No grafts and probably not phylloxera resistant just being in sand has protected them.
 

CK55

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Well, to be frank, I don't consider the vines in the photos "growing well". But they also seem to have been neglected. Maybe you have some more up to date photos of better, current growth?
Pics are 1 month back, vines we're neglected for decades. So yeah they treat well considering neglect.
 
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