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joeswine

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Move to the secondary add the oak let it set for a couple weeks then add the clarifying agents let it clear, you're ready to bottle.
 

ithink2020

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I'm still learning as well, but here are my thoughts.

"Move it?" You mean move it into the carboy (secondary) what ever the specific gravity is?
Wait until the SG stops dropping and is stable for 2 days. Around .996. Then rack to secondary.

So, we should do the clarifier step first, and two weeks later do step 2 to add oak, correct?
Here is what I would do:

1. Add Sulphite/Sorbate
2. Carefully Degass
3. Stir in Kieselsol, wait 24 hours
4. Stir in Chitosan
5. Stir in Oak chips/cubes
6. Let sit for 2 weeks, taste test oak level.
7. Taste test until you like the oak level.
8. Rack off oak into a clean carboy.
9. Let sit for 2 days, then bottle.

Or what Joe said :)
 
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sour_grapes

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We will check the specific gravity again tomorrow before we transfer it to carboy. If it is still low, do we need to let it sit in the primary with cherries until it's in range?
Yes, you should gauge whether or not to transfer to the carboy based on the S.G., and not on the time. But I think your phrasing seems off ("if it is still low...."). Your SG should be dropping during this time.

Your SG should be below about 1.010 before you transfer. Closer to 1.000 is also fine.
 

joeswine

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I always transfer over with some fermentation still left to do not a lot just at the edge this way I can transfer over and don't have to worry about oxidation and I take my time and let the wine take care of itself.
Try not to overthink it.
 

Chinook

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I started my (Italian) Pino Grigio 6 gal the Vineco standard "original" 4 week kit ( about 80 bucks Canadian).
I did a grapefruit zest. The grapefruit I used was the size of an orange. The store had "red" and "white" grapefruits. It was strange, usually I think of a grapefruit as rather large. Anyway, I lightly scraped a "red" and got about 1 1/2 TBSP of zest.
Added 1 TBSP zest to the primary I have some zest left , almost 1/2 TBSP don't know if to add it or not? or maybe to the secondary?. I don't know the effect of these zests.
..
Other tweaks I am considering.... I have in my wine pantry: tannin, American oak, a can of peaches. I heard apricots suggested, Maybe I have time to get to the supermarket and get some apricots. Any suggestions?
 

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joeswine

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that should be enough zest you'll be able to tell when you bottle , either way it'll work out great as far as a fresh peach is peaches go, fresh peaches workout better than canned peaches but can peaches can work ,only in the primary be prepared to add pectin enzyme also or it won't clear stay in touch keep thinking outside the box
 

Chinook

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that should be enough zest you'll be able to tell when you bottle , either way it'll work out great as far as a fresh peach is peaches go, fresh peaches workout better than canned peaches but can peaches can work ,only in the primary be prepared to add pectin enzyme also or it won't clear stay in touch keep thinking outside the box
OK I decided to add the can of peaches (398 ml = 13.5 oz) to the primary, even though it had been going about 4 days SG around 1.000. More fruit taste can't hurt for my taste),
Worst case - just change the profile a bit.

Late but I think it's ok. I got caught short, I have to do a" naked kill" no time for shopping, forgot to look at fruit last time at the supermarket.
Added yeast energizer, nutrient, 3 tsp pectic enzyme and a calculated amout of sugar to maintain the SG as pewr original ratio, as fruit might lower it (a very small amount)
Hoping it won't stall (if any sulfides in can) but still have 3 days to reach my usual standard of .990 SG
And if not , I think it will still ferment down. with a few extra days.
-----------
I still have the extra 1/3 TBSP zest but didn't add it - seems like it might be too powerful . I added 1 TBSP to primary - I'll leave it at that.
 

joeswine

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This will take time to clear use Petin enzyme 1level teaspoon to the secondary.let it vlear then re-rack and add all the rest of the chems.then let it rest for 2weeks then bottle.
 

Chinook

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OK I decided to add the can of peaches (398 ml = 13.5 oz) to the primary, even though it had been going about 4 days SG around 1.000. More fruit taste can't hurt for my taste),
Worst case - just change the profile a bit.

Late but I think it's ok. I got caught short, I have to do a" naked kill" no time for shopping, forgot to look at fruit last time at the supermarket.
Added yeast energizer, nutrient, 3 tsp pectic enzyme and a calculated amount of sugar to maintain the SG as per original ratio, as fruit might lower it (a very small amount)
Hoping it won't stall (if any sulfides in can) but still have 3 days to reach my usual standard of .990 SG
And if not , I think it will still ferment down. with a few extra days.
-----------
No worries about stalling - the peaches were gobbled up or transformed almost instantly. this morning SG was at .991 - So this is day 6 from the start and peaches added at day 4.
So it can be done late in game, this way!
--
OK thanks yeah I'll add pectic again in the secondary. - yeah I always rack at least once after transfer to carboy. I find it is worth the effort when it comes to filtering, I end up just filtering very clear wine, no lots of lees to complicate things or clog the filters.

For a 4 week kit my method is very standard generally speaking

week 1 primary - after 7 days max to carboy
week 2 stabilize after 7 days (14 days from start) (use the kit fining agents usually K & Chitosan)
week 3 (end of week 3) rack and use another fining agent - sparkloid
(So I do double fining, I swear by sparkloid - works very well)
week 4 end of week 4 filter and bottle
 

joeswine

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Tweaking cheap wine kits has been around awhile and has never stop being viewed and questions and answers, the winemaking talks family has been supportive of y blog as some have called it so let's start off the new year with some cheapese.
Cabernet sauvignon.. on these kits it's easier to let your hydromentor be your guid in the beginning and all through the process tweaks have a better response to the base in the primary.
 

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Chinook

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Started Vinco Merlot (Chile) cost 80 bucks Can, 4 week , 8 litres.
Added to primary , 600 gm Sweet Dark Cherries (= 21 oz) + will add the pkg oak chips that came with kit and also add supplementary 1 tsp tannin both in primary - tomorrow morn will add the yeast.
Plus 1 tsp pectic enzyme, plus some additional yeast nutrient and energizer in case the fruit pack has sulphide.

vinco
Done on Dec 17. I added another tsp tannin in the secondary post-stabilization. One tsp was added in the primary.
The kit pkg of oak was American oak.
Added more Pectic Enzyme in the secondary because of the added fruit.
I would say this was not the lowest end kit but just a step above - the ordinary kit ($80 Vineco standard)

Result: bottled 12 bottles dry, at 13% ABV, 19 bottles back sweetened at 1/3 CPG , (cup per gallon) sugar (.0208333 ratio) - 12.8 % ABV
Drank about 30 ml dry from the bottling - tasty passable,
Drank 65 ml back-sweetened - very tasty.
I do prefer back-sweetened generally but I think perhaps the sugaring brought out the fruit taste of the cherries.
I have another small taster 100 ml bottle leftover back-sweetened and I will try that at a later date to check out my theory..
The Merlot is good, I'll crack my first bottle later this year to check out how good it might be.
 
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Venatorscribe

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An interesting adjustment. You did well. Thirty one bottles. Did you add more than the standard measure of water or were you using smaller bottle sizes. Cheers

Result: bottled 12 bottles dry, at 13% ABV, 19 bottles back sweetened at 1/3 CPG , (cup per gallon) sugar (.0208333 ratio) - 12.8 % ABV
Drank about 30 ml dry from the bottling - tasty passable,
Drank 65 ml back-sweetened - very tasty.
I do prefer back-sweetened generally but I think perhaps the sugaring brought out the fruit taste of the cherries.
I have another small taster 100 ml bottle leftover back-sweetened and I will try that at a later date to check out my theory..
The Merlot is good, I'll crack my first bottle later this year to check out how good it might be.
 

joeswine

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that's exactly what happened with the sugar, did you do 5.5 gallons or 6 to start with?
What should happen is the less water you use the denser the fruit should be and yes the ABV. is higher also ,that should have balanced out the values.
Always remember wine making and tasting is subjective by its own nature and the makers.
 

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Chinook

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An interesting adjustment. You did well. Thirty one bottles. Did you add more than the standard measure of water or were you using smaller bottle sizes. Cheers
The sugar adds volume for one thing and..., You are right, I use more water than necessary - only a little bit and I use overflow bottles - sealed bottles of all sizes - process the overflow separately and merge it at all rackings.
The reason I do this is so that I am never short on making the ullage. I am afraid of air.

When I add little extra water I chapitalize it to the original SG which I take at the 6 gallon mark.
Actually it isn't even necessary to take another SG for the small amounts I add - I use the formula of .
3 pounds of sugar for one gallon = 14 % ABV
or 1.78 cups per one litre. = 14 % ABV.
Sometimes I want a higher ABV than the kit or recipe concerned.
There was added fruit and Tannin in this Merlot so there was compensation taste wise for the added water.


Most of the extra water/volume gets discarded as lees.
I'm leaning to be very precise so as to calculate just how much I need. It is different for every kind of wine or recipe - lot of guesswork and experience involved.
To get 31 bottles, there was probably only less than 500 ml ? filtered clear extra...then calculate sugar volume.
..
I use recycled bottles from the bottle depot. all kinds , all kinds like a pirate crew , I only pay 3 bucks a case , not 20.
I put them through a thorough cleaning process store them and then at at bottling time again they get sterilized with sulphide with a spritzer and rinsed with an adjuster on my kitchen tap and hung the night before to dry. A very fast process with the spritzer and the tap adjustement device.. The tap spray attachment device was a great boon to the cleaning process.
 

joeswine

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PHASE#2...Adding fresh fruit or fresh frozen is a great idea in the addition to the base wines characteristics.
Key rules ,fruit in the primary = partnership in the finial taste profile.
Key rules, fruit in the secondary= background enhancement.

But above all have fun with your wine making
 

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