Transfer to Secondary

[Flafemina]

When transferring from primary ferment bucket to the secondary ferment carboy. Is it better to siphon or pour? I don't want to disturb the must too much when transferring...is this a big concern?

 

[MrKevin]

Siphon while leaving as much sediment behind as possible.

Kevin

 

[TonyP]

Welcome.

Pouring is, by and large, a no-no in wine making. While being careful with sediment is good, the bigger issue is avoiding the addition of oxygen. Pouring wine into the carboy, no matter how carefully, adds to the risk of oxygen.

Concerning sediment, there's broadly two kinds - called gross and fine lees. If your primary contained gross lees (such as grape skins, stems, and the like), you'll want to be more careful than if all you have is fine lees (primarily dead yeast).

In my experience, must is the term used to describe grape juice, skins, seeds, etc before fermentation. Once yeast is added, the liquid is called wine and the solids are lees.

Tony P.

 

[Flafemina]

This is great information. Thank you. My first time making the wine and I dove right into.

 

[cpfan]

If you're making 6 US gallons, pouring will require Superman (or one of his friends) to hold the primary steady for the length of time it takes to pour it. So siphoning wins easily for most of us.

You would probably also need a large funnel. (When I ran a store I did have a couple of people want to buy a funnel for this exact purpose. Sold them Auto Siphons and some hose.)

If you're only making one gallon, pouring would probably work OK. As already expressed, oxidation would probably be an issue. But for a quick first batch without spending money on a siphon set-up, it will work. But you would need the siphon set-up sooner or later anyway.

Steve

 

[Flafemina]

I have an auto siphon I bought yesterday but the guy in the store told me to pour it. That didn't seem right and yes it's a 6 gallon and not very light. When I siphon into secondary how far off the bottom should I hold the end or should I just let it sit on the bottom?

 

[olusteebus]

To me, the best and cleanest way is to set up a vacuum pump and let that suck the wine into the carboy. YOu can do this without having to lift either the carboy or bucket. What you will need is a vacuum pump, some 3/8ths inch inside diameter clear vinyl hose, a 1/4 inside diameter nylon hose (both of which you can get at a lowes, hd) and a quarter inch barb and a two inlet carboy stopper (orange)from your wine supply store or a vendor here. You will also need a 12volt/120 volt converter if you don't have one. You can get them from walmart for about $18.

You can make your own vacuum pump for around $10 bucks, buy some medical suction pumps from around $50 or get the best, an allinonevacuumpump for around $200.

If you would like to save some money at this early point, here is a thread that shows you the way to build a vacuum from a 12 volt tire inflater.

 

[TonyP]

I have an auto siphon I bought yesterday but the guy in the store told me to pour it. That didn't seem right and yes it's a 6 gallon and not very light. When I siphon into secondary how far off the bottom should I hold the end or should I just let it sit on the bottom?

My suggestion is to hold the auto siphon several inches off the bottom and work it down before the wine level reaches it. When there's only a gallon or so left, gently lift the far end of the primary and siphon wine down as low as possible without getting the thick lees into the siphon. Try it with water first in a bucket to get the feel of it.

Keep in mind that the siphon has a tip to avoid siphoning off the bottom, but be careful anyway.

Tony P.

 

[cpfan]

Flafemina:

I don't know what you're making (ie from kit, juice, of fruit). I mostly make kits, and there is not a gross amount of lees (at least IMO). So i put the primary up on a tilt, insert the A-S part way to start it, and then gently lower the a-s to the bottom. If it pulls a bit of sedimaent to the carboy, no big deal, I'll be racking again, and clearing.

Steve

 

[Flafemina]

First time making wine in general but I am making it from juice. How are the kit wines?

 

[TonyP]

First time making wine in general but I am making it from juice. How are the kit wines?

Making wine from a kit is not much different from making it from juice. The big difference, of course, is that the ingredients are included. This saves time and effort for novice wine makers in determining which yeast and how much of everything to use, although recipes often provide much information.

Another benefit of kits is the ease in finding exactly what you want. And the choice today is very good.

Tony P.

 

[cpfan]

First time making wine in general but I am making it from juice. How are the kit wines?

Depends on the quality of the juice and the kit.

The better juices are better than the poorest kits, and the best kits are better than the poorer juices.

Are the best kits better than the best juices? May be personal opinion,

Steve

 

[emarcu1]

I make my wine from juice six gallon pails all Reds. I have racked once and i;m into my cold stabilization step right now . I have 3, 39 gallon carboys.

 

[cpfan]

I make my wine from juice six gallon pails all Reds. I have racked once and i;m into my cold stabilization step right now . I have 3, 39 gallon carboys.

Got any pictures? I've never seen a 39 gallon carboy.

Steve

 

[Rocky]

I have spigots in all of my primary fermenters (a 20 gallon, a 10 gallon and 2 7.9 gallon) and I have no problem with racking. I attach a length of tubing to the spigot, insert it in a carboy and open the spigot. When it starts to get near the bottom, I slide a 12" piece of 2x4 under the rear edge.

 

[emarcu1]

Got any pictures? I've never seen a 39 gallon carboy.

Steve

Sorry for my mistake. They are 150 liter Polly fermenters with airlocks and spigots. I have been using them for about 7 years or so. I purchased them from my juice supplier in illinois. You can see them at crossislandfruits.com.
I've made some pretty good wine in them using oak chips. They can be cleaned and reused easily.

 

[GaDawg]

I have a question about going from the primary bucket to the carboy. At this stage in the process doesn't the yeast need O2 to turn the sugar into alcohol? If so it would seem to me that incorporating O2 at the 1st racking would be a good thing?
Thanks for your help!

 

[Flafemina]

That's what I ended up doing. I splash racked my wine cause I thought I smelled sulfur. I'm on day 17 and my wine is looking very clear. Lots of sediment has dropped out of the wine. I hope it turns out good

 

[Ubiquitous35]

Splash racking is fine if you suspect a wine fault that has no other recourse than splash racking plus crossing your fingers. Aside from wine faults, after primary fermentation 7 to 10 days, there is not much sugar left and the oxygen introduced is more harmful than benefical with regard to completing fermentation. It could take 2 weeks to a month for the wine to complete fermentation to dry or less than 0.2% sugar. 0.2% to 0.4% is semi dry?, >0.4% is sweet wine? (question marks because i think these numbers are correct). Therefore, I would 1st rack, top off, lock down, re-rack and sulphite in 4 weeks if you are not testing at all. 1/4 tsp per 5 gallons Kmetra. Thats my opinion.

 

[ShepherdQ]

Ugh, poor planning got me again

I was faced with this very question, Flamina, but due to a lack of planning. I considered not even admitting to this, so putting in an existing thread rather than starting my own seems inconspicuous enough!

I'm doing my 2nd ever kit (RJS Cellar Class Winery Series California Cab Sav), and I racked it from the primary to the secondary yesterday. SG was where it should be, 1.009, everything was going fine until I got to the end and realized I hadn't bought any commercial wine to top up after siphoning. This was the first time I've used my autosiphon, too, and I found that it left a good 250-350mL in the bottom of the bucket. Now, if I had time I would have simply gone out and bought a bottle to top up, but I didn't, and my wine room is actually at my in-laws on the other side of town, so I panicked and came up with a jury-rig solution.

I diluted the dregs in the bottom of the bucket, let the heavy stuff settle for a couple minutes (already had an airlock on the secondary) then poured the remaining, diluted, wine into the secondary. I assume this will mean extra time bulk aging to allow the extra sediment to precipitate out, and a possibly diluted end product, but otherwise it should be ok, right? Fermentation isn't complete so the wine should be protecting itself for now, and with a good airlock on the risk of oxidation is minimal, despite pouring...I hope.