tankless water heater for winery

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olusteebus

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Anyone use a tankless water heater for your winery. It seems to me that may be a good way to go.

You don't really need that much hot water, just enough to help you sanitize.
 

GreginND

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I’ve never used one. I end up using a lot of hot water cleaning up from pressing and crushing. Can a tankless deliver hot water for a couple of hours continuously?
 

stickman

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Continuous hot water is what they were designed to do. There are only a few issues with the continuous hot water unit; they need a minimum water flow to trigger the heating so intermittent low flow use is not very good, they also are subject to minerals plating out on the heat exchange surface so they require acid re-circulation (depending on water quality maybe annually) to descale the exchanger.
 

Masbustelo

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I have one that is 12 years old also, 180,000BTU. You could run it continuously for "months" and never run out of hot water. For better or worse I've never done any maintenance or repairs on mine. They are pretty amazing as far as being reliable.
 

Smok1

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Our company installs tankless water heaters and i can say from a service tech standpoint they are a pita,
first the heat exhangers need to be flushed once a year, water quality come into play alot with a tankless, if your water is suseptable to scale buildup plan on flushing every year
second if they break down they cost alot more for parts than a conventional water tank,
third they do break down much more frequently than a conventional water tank,
fourth if your on a water meter plan on spending more money running water waiting for the hot water to get to your tap, we typically have to go back and install recirc pumps for the customers which is another cost in itself. A conventional hot water tank stores hot water and copper piping is exellent at conducting heat which is why you dont have to wait long when turning on the taps to get hot water, tankless if not used for a while the pipes get cold, weve had customers that have to run there showers for over a minute before the water gets hot with a tankless
Fifth, they are much more expensive than a conventional water tank and typicall run about 200,000btus while they are running


Dont buy a tankless if you plan on saving money, weve had numerous complaints after “upgrading” customers to the new tankless design, conventional water tanks now have much better insulation R ratings than ever before and are a fraction of the price of a tankless, much less parts to break down conventionals only have a standard gas valve and a burner and thermocouple whereas a tankless has a ton of parts, very tight heat exchangers that get plugged up, large 200,000btu gasvalve burner, a bunch of highlimit, flow switches, water temp sensors that are all prone to failure. You might be one of the lucky ones who buy one and dont have issues with it but if your not i promise you will regret it.

Another issue is make sure you size them for your biggest demand, for instance they size them based on fixtures ( 4 fixtures, 8 fixtures) if you ever plan on running a dishwasher, doing laundry, and having a shower at the same time plan on buying a 200,000 plus btu unit, we ussually install 400,000 btu units for a household of 4 people or more.

I dont wanna seem like there all crap but coming from a service technician where we warranty the product for the first year its a real pita, i absolutely hate working on them, then after the first year i have to listen to customer complaints on how much they cost to maintenance and repair if they break down, we always try and talk people out of buying them now unless space is a factor.
 
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ibglowin

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OK, Help a fellow winemaker out. Our water heater is a Sears Kenmore that is now 34 years old. LOL We have owned this house for 17 of those 34 years. I want to replace it before it fails (self install) What is a reliable brand these days for a regular tank (50G gas) heater? If you look at the reviews from the Big Box boys it looks like they are all crap.

Our company installs tankless water heaters and i can say from a service tech standpoint they are a pita,
first the heat exhangers need to be flushed once a year, water quality come into play alot with a tankless, if your water is suseptable to scale buildup plan on flushing every year
second if they break down they cost alot more for parts than a conventional water tank,
third they do break down much more frequently than a conventional water tank,
fourth if your on a water meter plan on spending more money running water waiting for the hot water to get to your tap, we typically have to go back and install recirc pumps for the customers which is another cost in itself. A conventional hot water tank stores hot water and copper piping is exellent at conducting heat which is why you dont have to wait long when turning on the taps to get hot water, tankless if not used for a while the pipes get cold, weve had customers that have to run there showers for over a minute before the water gets hot with a tankless
Fifth, they are much more expensive than a conventional water tank and typicall run about 200,000btus while they are running


Dont buy a tankless if you plan on saving money, weve had numerous complaints after “upgrading” customers to the new tankless design, conventional water tanks now have much better insulation R ratings than ever before and are a fraction of the price of a tankless, much less parts to break down conventionals only have a standard gas valve and a burner and thermocouple whereas a tankless has a ton of parts, very tight heat exchangers that get plugged up, large 200,000btu gasvalve burner, a bunch of highlimit, flow switches, water temp sensors that are all prone to failure. You might be one of the lucky ones who buy one and dont have issues with it but if your not i promise you will regret it.

Another issue is make sure you size them for your biggest demand, for instance they size them based on fixtures ( 4 fixtures, 8 fixtures) if you ever plan on running a dishwasher, doing laundry, and having a shower at the same time plan on buying a 200,000 plus btu unit, we ussually install 400,000 btu units for a household of 4 people or more.

I dont wanna seem like there all crap but coming from a service technician where we warranty the product for the first year its a real pita, i absolutely hate working on them, then after the first year i have to listen to customer complaints on how much they cost to maintenance and repair if they break down, we always try and talk people out of buying them now unless space is a factor.
 

Boatboy24

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OK, Help a fellow winemaker out. Our water heater is a Sears Kenmore that is now 34 years old. LOL We have owned this house for 17 of those 34 years. I want to replace it before it fails (self install) What is a reliable brand these days for a regular tank (50G gas) heater? If you look at the reviews from the Big Box boys it looks like they are all crap.
Dude, I'd replace that tomorrow if it were mine.

We ended up going with this one: https://www.homedepot.com/p/Rheem-Performance-Platinum-75-Gal-Tall-12-Year-76-000-BTU-Natural-Gas-Water-Heater-XG75T12ST76U0/205811143

A couple neighbors have had it for a few years and in both cases no complaints so far. Bigger than what you need/want, but they have multiple sizes. We used the HD installation and the installed price for this one ended up only being $30 more than the installed price for the same heater w/ 6 year warranty. We were looking at the 6 year initially, but for that small a difference decided it was totally worth it. The only difference between them, as was explained to me, was in the 'lining'. Aside from that, you're basically buying insurance.
 

Smok1

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OK, Help a fellow winemaker out. Our water heater is a Sears Kenmore that is now 34 years old. LOL We have owned this house for 17 of those 34 years. I want to replace it before it fails (self install) What is a reliable brand these days for a regular tank (50G gas) heater? If you look at the reviews from the Big Box boys it looks like they are all crap.

We typically would install rheem or john wood as thats what most wholesalers carry and the replacement parts are decent brand names and easy to find and not expensive.
 

ibglowin

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LOL I knew it was old but when I actually found the MFG date on the side I was like holy crap! It works great still, pilot light has gone out a couple times from high winds that blew it out but it has served us well for sure. Natural gas is dirt cheap in these parts also since we are a huge producer.

Are there any issues with using Shark Bite or Pex fittings assuming you use ones rated for a hot water heater install?

Dude, I'd replace that tomorrow if it were mine.
 

Smok1

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LOL I knew it was old but when I actually found the MFG date on the side I was like holy crap! It works great still, pilot light has gone out a couple times from high winds that blew it out but it has served us well for sure.

Are there any issues with using Shark Bite or Pex fittings assuming you use ones rated for a hot water heater install?
We ussually use copper and solder but pex is fine too, i wouldnt use shark bites if it were my tank because there prone to leaking but there are an approved fitting
 

Boatboy24

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LOL I knew it was old but when I actually found the MFG date on the side I was like holy crap! It works great still, pilot light has gone out a couple times from high winds that blew it out but it has served us well for sure.
I thought we were lucky with our 22+ year old heater until I learned of the legend of yours. :)
 

pjd

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And if you want to buy American you really have only one choice... Bradford White
 

cmason1957

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And if you want to buy American you really have only one choice... Bradford White
Rheem is made in Mississippi and is an American Company with a worldwide presence.
 
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