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AZMDTed

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Ted,

Do you still have bare concrete flooring in your cellar? :sh
Yes I do, and aside from you maybe jinxing me now I've never had an issue :h

I've kept them bare for the cooling effect of the earth underneath. In winter time the AC barely runs.

My carboys that don't fit on my shelves are on wooden pallets off the floor. I imagine I may change my priorities once I drop or bottle or split a carboy, but so far so good.

As a side benefit, having a bare floor allows me to toss in a couple cups of water if I'm going to be away for a while and want to add to the humidity.

I will admit though that some simple laminate flooring would look mighty nice in there.
 

ibglowin

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There is an old saying that there are two types of winemakers. Those that have dropped a full carboy to the ground and those who someday will....... :)

I was going to suggest a small insurance policy where needed in case a bottle slips out of the rack and crashes to the floor or worse a full carboy.......





Yes I do, and aside from you maybe jinxing me now I've never had an issue :h
 

Boatboy24

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There is an old saying that there are two types of winemakers. Those that have dropped a full carboy to the ground and those who someday will....... :)

I was going to suggest a small insurance policy where needed in case a bottle slips out of the rack and crashes to the floor or worse a full carboy.......

Been meaning to do that in my winery. To date, I've had only one mishap, which involved an empty bottle falling from the workbench to the floor (after I clumsily knocked it over). Worst part: At the end of what seemed to be a slow motion descent, the bottle actually bounced. For a very brief moment, I thought: 'wow, dodged a bullet there'. The bottle didn't fare so well on the second impact - glass everywhere.
 

toneill

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Nice work AZMDTed! I'm in the process of expanding my wine operation to a new storage room, 12'X13', finished room in the basement. I'm shopping for a cooler and was looking at the N'Finity 4200 (1K Cubic Ft Capacity). I'm curious if anyone has any experience with this brand? Choose it for the warranty. I like what you and others have done with the air conditioner but I was thinking of going the cooler route for size and humidity reasons. Thoughts? At $1650 am I wasting my money? Thanks.
 

Rmarr

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My wine room is finished. This weekend I built a shelf unit for my barrel and carboys and that finishes the job. Overall, I’m very pleased with it. The air conditioning and the controller seem to be working well and are maintaining a good temperature with only a few minutes an hour of run time. The Seville Wine Racks are a great way to store a lot of wine in a small space. My wooden bottle rack let’s me highlight those bottles I want to see the labels on and are in the queue for drinking. I’m also very happy with the shelves I build for my carboys. They can hold six, which means somewhere around 360 pounds. That’s something I don’t want to have come crashing down so I over designed it and like how it turned out. This room will also change how I make my wine. Now, as soon as I get them properly degassed and cleared I can get the carboys into the cooler while they await their turn in the Vadai rather than spending a year in the basement under airlock. But degassing is another story.

Since these threads stick around for a while I figure somebody may have a similar notion down the road. If you do, here is some information about the project.

The finished room is 5’ x 7’ inside, 2x4 construction on five sides, open concrete basement for thermal cooling on the floor. Insulation was spray closed cell foam. Mold resistant green board inside. An LED light with about 120W of light for 43W. Cheap 5K BTU window air conditioner, modified to avoid it turning itself off at cool temps, and controlled by a temperature controller that lets me set the target temperature and the number of degrees leeway I want it to have before it kicks on again. I added an indoor/outdoor thermometer by the door to keep me from going in and checking it all the time. I figure that this can hold about 500 bottles and 6 carboys.

The total cost was about $2,000. Insulation was the largest expense at $750. Aside from the controller, thermometer and Insulation kit, everything was purchased at Lowes or Home Depot. Here’s a gross breakdown:

AC: $135
Controller: $ 40
Insulation Kit: $750
30” Ex Door: $175
Lumber, drywall, electrical, paint etc: $600
2 Seville Racks: $200
Wood for carboy shelf: $100

The project took 4 weekends, and two weeks of evening work and I did it alone. For now, about the only change I would make would be to look harder to get a cost estimate from a professional insulation company. I didn’t do it this time because I was in hurry to get it done and didn’t know when I’d be ready for it and I thought I could do it well enough with a kit. I did an okay job, but I think a pro would do it much better, though I don’t know the cost and how many would do such a small project. Other than that I’m pleased with it. It’s certainly isn’t a showcase piece, but it’s functional and suits my space. If things ever change, the room becomes: 1., Tornado Shelter, 2., walk in closet, 3., indoor green house, 4., fancy indoor storage shed. Multipurpose :)

I hope this helps someone who was wondering about their options for storing wine.

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Wow what an amazing room. I’m currently building mine now and was wondering if you installed any vents to transfer the air pressure from you cooling unit? I was considering putting one or two in to help depressorize the room. I personally wraped my room in 6mil vapor and insulated with Roxul R23 in wall and R30 in ceiling. Going to be using my temp controller just like you did. Thanks for sharing all you hard work!
 

stickman

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Nice work AZMDTed! I'm in the process of expanding my wine operation to a new storage room, 12'X13', finished room in the basement. I'm shopping for a cooler and was looking at the N'Finity 4200 (1K Cubic Ft Capacity). I'm curious if anyone has any experience with this brand? Choose it for the warranty. I like what you and others have done with the air conditioner but I was thinking of going the cooler route for size and humidity reasons. Thoughts? At $1650 am I wasting my money? Thanks.

The N'Finity looks like a re-branded Cellarcool unit, they get decent reviews, but I haven't had a chance to use my Cellarcool long term. I'm still using a 16 year old Vintage Keeper that wont quit, but I figure it could happen at any time, so when a friend offered a Cellarcool CX4400 for $200, I couldn't pass it up. I offered more money and he wouldn't take it, he got it from an estate sale, it had been installed, but never used. I tested it, and it works fine, so now it sits on the floor just waiting to be put to use. The Danfoss compressor in the Vintage Keeper just wont die, I'm not complaining.........
 

AZMDTed

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Wow what an amazing room. I’m currently building mine now and was wondering if you installed any vents to transfer the air pressure from you cooling unit? I was considering putting one or two in to help depressorize the room. I personally wraped my room in 6mil vapor and insulated with Roxul R23 in wall and R30 in ceiling. Going to be using my temp controller just like you did. Thanks for sharing all you hard work!
Thanks. I didn’t put any vents in. The AC runs such a short period of time that I don’t believe it builds up any pressure issues. Almost 2 years now and it’s all still working great. The small room humidifier does a good job keeping the humidity up about 70 percent, and the room stays a fairly constant 59 degrees.
 

wrongway

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AZMDTed

What a nice project!! Would like to do the same myself! I do have one question though. If 500 bottle is small, What would a large one be?
:b
 

AZMDTed

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AZMDTed

What a nice project!! Would like to do the same myself! I do have one question though. If 500 bottle is small, What would a large one be?
:b
Thanks, as to your question, a large, and beautiful, one would be what @Johnd built.
 

Rmarr

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Thanks. I didn’t put any vents in. The AC runs such a short period of time that I don’t believe it builds up any pressure issues. Almost 2 years now and it’s all still working great. The small room humidifier does a good job keeping the humidity up about 70 percent, and the room stays a fairly constant 59 degrees.
@AZMDTed your project inspired me to finish mine. I used a ink bird controler to keep the AC pumping and its maintaining 58 now. I also decided not to add vents like I ask you about. I built the floor to ceiling racks. May add more later. What you cant see is my 6x24 bottle cubes behind the picture. Thanks for posting your project and inspiring me.
 

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AZMDTed

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@AZMDTed your project inspired me to finish mine. I used a ink bird controler to keep the AC pumping and its maintaining 58 now. I also decided not to add vents like I ask you about. I built the floor to ceiling racks. May add more later. What you cant see is my 6x24 bottle cubes behind the picture. Thanks for posting your project and inspiring me.
That looks great, well done. I've learned much from others here and posted this thread as payback for that assistance. I'm glad you found it inspiring.
 

Tom Martin

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@AZMDTed your project inspired me to finish mine. I used a ink bird controler to keep the AC pumping and its maintaining 58 now. I also decided not to add vents like I ask you about. I built the floor to ceiling racks. May add more later. What you cant see is my 6x24 bottle cubes behind the picture. Thanks for posting your project and inspiring me.
Your racks are really nice that is what I would like to build, where did you find the plans to build your racks? What kind of wood did you use?
 

Tom Martin

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AZMDTed, your room is great I am looking to finish 1/2 of my basement in the next year and I have been thinking of a wine cellar type room in the north east corner. I am not sure if cooling will be needed or not. My basement is fully under ground the corner I am building in will have 2 bare concrete walls where there is no sun contact.
 

AZMDTed

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AZMDTed, your room is great I am looking to finish 1/2 of my basement in the next year and I have been thinking of a wine cellar type room in the north east corner. I am not sure if cooling will be needed or not. My basement is fully under ground the corner I am building in will have 2 bare concrete walls where there is no sun contact.
Tom,

You may not need AC in your condition. Also consider the floor and whether it is close enough to a heated space to transfer that heat into your room. In my case I live on a slope so the wine room area of my basement is mostly underground, but nearby the other half of the space is my garage and they share the same slab. The warmth of the garage concrete is enough to effect the concrete in the cellar.

If you go passive, this book is considered the best statement on how to do it:

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0006YRFBC/?tag=skimlinks_replacement-20

Have fun.
 
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AZMDTed

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If that link doesn't work, here's a better one:

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0006YRFBC/?tag=skimlinks_replacement-20

I tried to edit the above post twice and it's not taking the change.

EDIT, interesting, the link I'm posting gets changed as soon as I hit save or post. The book is:

How and Why to Build a Passive Wine Cellar: and Gold's Guide to Wine Tasting and Cellaring
 
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Tom Martin

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Tom,

You may not need AC in your condition. Also consider the floor and whether it is close enough to a heated space to transfer that heat into your room. In my case I live on a slope so the wine room area of my basement is mostly underground, but nearby the other half of the space is my garage and they share the same slab. The warmth of the garage concrete is enough to effect the concrete in the cellar.

If you go passive, this book is considered the best statement on how to do it:

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0006YRFBC/?tag=skimlinks_replacement-20

Have fun.
I will look at that book.
My plan was to leave the bare concrete floor and remove the insulation so two of the walls will be bare concrete walls. I was planing on insulating the walls between the cellar and basement. My basement is fully under ground with about a 9 ft ceiling 104".
My only issue is my brew area is in the opposite corner but that's were the drain and water heater are located. My heater is on the 2nd story so there is not heat from that in the basement, the closest heater vent is 15 ft from where I am locating the cellar.
 
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Rmarr

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Your racks are really nice that is what I would like to build, where did you find the plans to build your racks? What kind of wood did you use?
Thank you, I built them out of rough cut cedar, however left them to air dry for over a year. I didnt want that cedar smell in my cellar. And happy to say its not there. I would think pine or maple would make an excellent choice. But giving my budget at the time milling my rough cut cedar was they cheaper option. I did leave it all unfinished as I prefer the rustic feel. I got my plans from a book called “home built winery” by steve hughes. He has excellent ideas but some basic dimensions are missing. Have to interperate alot of things. Hope this helps you.
 

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