Reusing Lees?

[HB_in_Subic]

I have a bottle of untreated mango wine about half full of lees and the rest wine. It has been in my refrigerator for almost a month. Is there any advantage in using these lees for my next batch of mango wine? Or is it better to just use some fresh yeast?

 

[Julie]

There have been people who has re-used it and with great success but I think it is risky, most will take the lees and make a batch of skeeter pee with it.

 

[wineinmd]

When I put on my homebrewing hat, I see nothing wrong with that, since I re-use yeast there. That said, the reason I do that is because liquid yeast is about $7/vial. With wine yeast being about $1/pouch, I'd have a hard time justifying using it on anything other than small batches or skeeter pee like Julie suggests.

 

[JohnT]

I would go with new yeast. You have no idea of the condition of the yeast in the lees.

 

[HB_in_Subic]

Thanks for the advice. I will use it on the skeeter pee which was already on my list to make.

 

[wineinmd]

I would go with new yeast. You have no idea of the condition of the yeast in the lees.

If we know the type of yeast, the % alcohol of the finished wine, and the fermentation temperature, we can get a decent idea of the health of the yeast. I'd avoid anything that got near the upper recommended range of either % alcohol or fermentation temperatures since the yeast would probably be stressed.

If care was taken during fermentation and it wasn't pushing any upper limits, I'd say the yeast are probably quite healthy and happy. I make low-mid ABV beer with fairly strict temperature control and my re-used yeast has worked great. You can see a nice healthy layer of yeast in the jars I use and fermentation kicks off and finishes without any issues.

Again, I wouldn't use it in a $100+ kit, but for a small batch of fruit wine or skeeter pee, I'd go ahead and re-use it. You definitely won't need the full amount in the jug, so I'd siphon the wine off the top, add a couple cups of water that has been boiled then cooled, swirl everything up, and then take about 1/4 of that slurry for the new batch.

 

[JohnT]

If we know the type of yeast, the % alcohol of the finished wine, and the fermentation temperature, we can get a decent idea of the health of the yeast. I'd avoid anything that got near the upper recommended range of either % alcohol or fermentation temperatures since the yeast would probably be stressed.

If care was taken during fermentation and it wasn't pushing any upper limits, I'd say the yeast are probably quite healthy and happy. I make low-mid ABV beer with fairly strict temperature control and my re-used yeast has worked great. You can see a nice healthy layer of yeast in the jars I use and fermentation kicks off and finishes without any issues.

Again, I wouldn't use it in a $100+ kit, but for a small batch of fruit wine or skeeter pee, I'd go ahead and re-use it. You definitely won't need the full amount in the jug, so I'd siphon the wine off the top, add a couple cups of water that has been boiled then cooled, swirl everything up, and then take about 1/4 of that slurry for the new batch.

You are correct, the lees is PROBABLY fine, but then again it might not be. You need to keep in mind that this is not beer. The chance of stressed yeast in wine lees, IMHO, is far greater. I still advise to avoid any risk and spend the $2 for new yeast.

BTW, I would never advise adding water to a must. You will only raise the PH and cut down on the sugar and flavor of the end product.

 

[Bergmann]

heck I get yeast for $30.00 .....Per 100 box. Being frugal is great, In fact I forage for a great deal of the things I make wine from. Some times there are limits. The slurry may be OK, and most likely safe. But one never knows what off flavors it may produce.

 

[wineinmd]

You are correct, the lees is PROBABLY fine, but then again it might not be. You need to keep in mind that this is not beer. The chance of stressed yeast in wine lees, IMHO, is far greater. I still advise to avoid any risk and spend the $2 for new yeast.

BTW, I would never advise adding water to a must. You will only raise the PH and cut down on the sugar and flavor of the end product.

This isn't beer, but yeast are yeast. If kept well within the manufacturer's recommended ranges, I do not see why they would care what medium they are in. I get that the higher alcohol in wine can be a concern, but most wine yeast are made to handle that. EC-1118 can go up to 18%. If the original wine was in the 12-13% range, I don't see that as an overly stressful environment for that particular strain.

Fair point about the water, especially if it is used in a small batch of fruit wine, but the amount that ends up in the new wine is quite small if you follow solid practices. Only using enough to re-suspend the lees and decanting the majority of the liquid off the slurry after it settles just prior to pitching should keep the amount of water going into the new batch to a minimum.

All that said, if I had an extra pouch of yeast, I'd probably go ahead and use it. If not though, I wouldn't have any qualms in a small batch using the lees given appropriate care of yeast.

Just out of curiosity, what is your take on using lees in SP?

 

[JohnT]

This isn't beer, but yeast are yeast. If kept well within the manufacturer's recommended ranges, I do not see why they would care what medium they are in. I get that the higher alcohol in wine can be a concern, but most wine yeast are made to handle that. EC-1118 can go up to 18%. If the original wine was in the 12-13% range, I don't see that as an overly stressful environment for that particular strain.

Fair point about the water, especially if it is used in a small batch of fruit wine, but the amount that ends up in the new wine is quite small if you follow solid practices. Only using enough to re-suspend the lees and decanting the majority of the liquid off the slurry after it settles just prior to pitching should keep the amount of water going into the new batch to a minimum.

All that said, if I had an extra pouch of yeast, I'd probably go ahead and use it. If not though, I wouldn't have any qualms in a small batch using the lees given appropriate care of yeast.

Just out of curiosity, what is your take on using lees in SP?

SP is a different story. You need a rather populous starter of yeast to get it going and there is not much at stake ($15 worth of sugar and lemon). The needs outweigh the risk.

 

[HB_in_Subic]

This is from a mango wine that finished at 16% using EC-1118 fermented at 74F constant. I also step fed the must at the 1/3 sugar breaks achieving FG (0.988) in 9 days.

If I use this for skeeter pee, is 300ml enough for a 5 gallon batch or should I try to scale back the recipe for 1 gallon?

I have reused yeast for beer all of the time with great success. Most of my brews are at 6%.

 

[cmason1957]

I have made skeeter pee probably 10 times. I have never and have no plans to ever use old lees to start it. I only add two bottles of lemon at the start, then the third about half way through fermentation. For the $1 that yeast costs it isn't even worth taking a chance on it.