Oak and Syrah

[AR324]

I am thinking of doing a Syrah frozen must bucket from California. I want to emphasize the fruit and go light on the oak. Any thoughts on the type of oak cubes to use? French? American? Light toast etc.

 

[mainshipfred]

I am thinking of doing a Syrah frozen must bucket from California. I want to emphasize the fruit and go light on the oak. Any thoughts on the type of oak cubes to use? French? American? Light toast etc.

I'm in the same school as you because I also believe oaking takes away from the fruitiness. I might recommend medium French or Hungarian and use spirals or staves instead of cubes. If you feel it's getting too oaky you can just remove them. Cubes are a lot more difficult.

 

[winemaker81]

Use medium toast -- medium plus or dark toast may flavor the wine more than you want.

The wine stix experiment I did a while back leads me to believe the wine goes through cycles during aging with oak, so I'd rather leave the oak in longer, to get the most from the oak.

I prefer cubes as the amount used is highly configurable, although as Fred pointed out, getting the oak out of the wine isn't as easy. To maintain fruitiness, I'd go with 1/2 to 1 oz in 5/6 US gallons, although it may be best to err on the side of caution and start with 1/2 oz. Let the wine age 4 months, stir, and taste. If it's not enough oak flavoring, you can add 1/4 to 1/2 oz more.

I used 1 oz in a FWK Tavola Barbera (no skin packs) and it came out with good fruit. The Syrah will be a heavier wine, so it will handle more oak without the fruit being overpowered, although going light is best -- it's far easier to add more than to take some out.

Note: Wine doesn't have convection currents so the wine closest to the oak will absorb the oak flavoring, and wine away from the oak won't. I use cubes in neutral barrels and stir gently each time I topup the barrels, so the oakiness is distributed. Tasting the wine without stirring will give a false impression, depending on where in the container the wine is drawn from.

In the oak stix experiment I got more fruitiness from the American oak, vs the French or Hungarian. It was surprising. Generally I prefer Hungarian oak, but for this I'd use American. Note that I used Hungarian in my Barbera and I'm pleased with it, so there are no wrong answers here.

Ask a question of 10 winemakers, get at least 11 answers.

 

[AR324]

I'm in the same school as you because I also believe oaking takes away from the fruitiness. I might recommend medium French or Hungarian and use spirals or staves instead of cubes. If you feel it's getting too oaky you can just remove them. Cubes are a lot more difficult.

Thanks. I have used the Hungarian Med + with my Cab Franc and Merlot and was very pleased. French Med or medium + is another go to for me.

 

[AR324]

Use medium toast -- medium plus or dark toast may flavor the wine more than you want.

The wine stix experiment I did a while back leads me to believe the wine goes through cycles during aging with oak, so I'd rather leave the oak in longer, to get the most from the oak.

I prefer cubes as the amount used is highly configurable, although as Fred pointed out, getting the oak out of the wine isn't as easy. To maintain fruitiness, I'd go with 1/2 to 1 oz in 5/6 US gallons, although it may be best to err on the side of caution and start with 1/2 oz. Let the wine age 4 months, stir, and taste. If it's not enough oak flavoring, you can add 1/4 to 1/2 oz more.

I used 1 oz in a FWK Tavola Barbera (no skin packs) and it came out with good fruit. The Syrah will be a heavier wine, so it will handle more oak without the fruit being overpowered, although going light is best -- it's far easier to add more than to take some out.

Note: Wine doesn't have convection currents so the wine closest to the oak will absorb the oak flavoring, and wine away from the oak won't. I use cubes in neutral barrels and stir gently each time I topup the barrels, so the oakiness is distributed. Tasting the wine without stirring will give a false impression, depending on where in the container the wine is drawn from.

In the oak stix experiment I got more fruitiness from the American oak, vs the French or Hungarian. It was surprising. Generally I prefer Hungarian oak, but for this I'd use American. Note that I used Hungarian in my Barbera and I'm pleased with it, so there are no wrong answers here.

Ask a question of 10 winemakers, get at least 11 answers.

Good advice on the distribution of the oak. I tend to go with medium plus, Hungarian or French. I’ve yet to use American.

Midwest Supplies has a Bordeaux Blend, a Tuscan Blend and a West Coast Blend. I’ve used the first two for Merlot and Malbec. Very pleased.

 

[AR324]

Thanks. I have used the Hungarian Med + with my Cab Franc and Merlot and was very pleased. French Med or medium + is another go to for me.

PS. I was thinking about light American, as you suggested. I have never used American but I did note that the light toast is supposed to enhance the fruit.

I may give it a try.