Moving from carboys to variable volume stainless steel tanks

[DaveMcC]

Hoping to get some informed opinions on the use of 110L Speidel variable volume tanks for secondary fermentation/storage. Deciding on whether to build a solid bench for the tanks (3) or more steel shelving units to add 6 more 6 gallon carboys.

1. Advantages/disadvantages of storing wine in these tanks.
2. Experience with the Speidel 110L (29 gal) tank, especially when using with smaller volumes (15-20 gals) in the tank.

Basically want to know if I should stick with glass or invest in SS. I am growing a 110 gallon per year home hobby to the next level, exploring going commercial. Any informed input is welcome. Thanks.

 

[Boatboy24]

I certainly know nothing about going commercial. But I would wager that you don't want to be in glass at those volumes.

 

[sjjan]

I am using variable volume Speidel tanks of 300 liter each. The larger the stainless steel tanks, the better due to larger batch sizes with less risk of oxidation etc.
I have used the 100 liter tanks as well if the batch size was just too large to fit in the 300 liter tanks. Can’t go wrong with Speidel quality SS tanks.

 

[VinesnBines]

I'll let other commercial folks weigh in but you are better off with a larger tank than several carboys. I would suggest you think bigger than 110L since the variable capacity tanks will hold as little as two gallons. Think about how much you plan to make and purchase a larger size. You will outgrow a 110L in a hurry. Marchisio is a quality brand too.

 

[sjjan]

You don’t want just a small bit of wine in the bottom of a way larger tank with the lid way down there. Difficult to deal with taking samples or air/water locks in the lid and too much surface area in relation to the quantity of wine. The lid sits not all the time exactly on top of the wine below it.

 

[Jbu50]

You don’t want just a small bit of wine in the bottom of a way larger tank with the lid way down there. Difficult to deal with taking samples or air/water locks in the lid and too much surface area in relation to the quantity of wine. The lid sits not all the time exactly on top of the wine below it.

I just bought a 150L tank yesterday, never used one before. How do you know that the lid does not sit directly on top of the wine? Is this a common issue, design flaw, or user error?

 

[sjjan]

I just bought a 150L tank yesterday, never used one before. How do you know that the lid does not sit directly on top of the wine? Is this a common issue, design flaw, or user error?

No design error. You can easily just float the lid on the fluid and then pump up the tubes and it will be closed right on top of the juice. Then next time, you take a sample from the wine for measurements and tasting. Then you don't want to lower the lid each time to sit on the juice again as you would brake the seal each time again and expose the wine to oxygen coming in.

 

[sjjan]

During primary fermentation you don't put the lid right on top of the juice but allow some space for the fermentation to expand/foam. Only when the fermentation is done, you will lower the lid.

 

[DaveMcC]

Thanks for these responses. Perfect example of what makes this forum so great for us.
I went ahead and bought 3 of the Speidel 110L tanks. Tempted by the lower price of the Marchisio, which are also good quality, but the vinyl seals pose a bit of a problem for some folks although I hear you can upgrade those to something similar to what Speidel uses. I had some external funding to play with, so went with the high end. 110L fits my current capacity per each varietal at present. I will most likely expand to larger tanks in the coming two years.

 

[DaveMcC]

That's quite a setup, sjjan. Would love to stop in one day and get a tour. I see what looks like a glycol cooling system running through 3 of the tanks. Are there distinctions between commercial and private/home use (untaxed or unlicensed) in the Netherlands for various quantities? Just curious.

 

[sjjan]

That's quite a setup, sjjan. Would love to stop in one day and get a tour. I see what looks like a glycol cooling system running through 3 of the tanks. Are there distinctions between commercial and private/home use (untaxed or unlicensed) in the Netherlands for various quantities? Just curious.

You are always welcome to stop by. but it is a long ways from South Carolina haha.
We have several glycol coolers. Depending on the stage of fermentation, we might link up several tanks to one gllycol cooler to just keep the wine/juice cool at e.g. 16 degrees C.

In The Netherlands, you can just make at home the amount you can drink with your friends and family, not sell any of it. After that, you need a commercial license and it cannot be make at home anymore. So, I moved the winemaking hobby to the basement underneath the business of my wife. It is a small basement. The pressing I do outside. I will upload a video of it if I can. The customs/tax authorities want money for producing alcohol and the city needs to provide a zoning permit. All in all it was a lot of paperwork.

 

[DaveMcC]

You are always welcome to stop by. but it is a long ways from South Carolina haha.
We have several glycol coolers. Depending on the stage of fermentation, we might link up several tanks to one gllycol cooler to just keep the wine/juice cool at e.g. 16 degrees C.

In The Netherlands, you can just make at home the amount you can drink with your friends and family, not sell any of it. After that, you need a commercial license and it cannot be make at home anymore. So, I moved the winemaking hobby to the basement underneath the business of my wife. It is a small basement. The pressing I do outside. I will upload a video of it if I can. The customs/tax authorities want money for producing alcohol and the city needs to provide a zoning permit. All in all it was a lot of paperwork.

We've been to NL several times over the years. One of our favorite places and some ancestry from there on my mother's French Huguenot side of the family. Vanarsdales, Coverts, etc. Took our young boys to Madurodam in the 90s, have gone to the North Sea Jazz Festival in Rotterdam a few times. Amsterdam many times, trips into the countryside. Lovely place and beautiful country and people.

 

[DaveMcC]

You are always welcome to stop by. but it is a long ways from South Carolina haha.
We have several glycol coolers. Depending on the stage of fermentation, we might link up several tanks to one gllycol cooler to just keep the wine/juice cool at e.g. 16 degrees C.

In The Netherlands, you can just make at home the amount you can drink with your friends and family, not sell any of it. After that, you need a commercial license and it cannot be make at home anymore. So, I moved the winemaking hobby to the basement underneath the business of my wife. It is a small basement. The pressing I do outside. I will upload a video of it if I can. The customs/tax authorities want money for producing alcohol and the city needs to provide a zoning permit. All in all it was a lot of paperwork.

Yeah, similar here. I am looking into going commercial so I could sell some, but the federal, state and local permits and taxation are a bit complex. First though, I have to make wine that people will buy . Once you get up to producing 30 to 40 cases of wine a year, it has to go somewhere.

 

[sjjan]

This is the wine press. It is configured to run a 13 step program and goes to 1.3 bar or higher if you want to. The juice is pumped into the Speidel tank in the cellar afterwards.

 

[sjjan]

And here a short video. My son in law is playing with the press