How to make an f-pac

Wine Making Talk

Help Support Wine Making Talk:

Joined
Sep 24, 2011
Messages
20
Reaction score
3
Okay, newbie here... I've got plum and peach wines in secondary right now. Hubby and I were talking about f-packs...not sure if we'll need to make them or not for a future racking, but reading up on how to make them "just in case". What is this "k-meta" I'm reading about?? We've got the potassium sorbate and I know that is to prevent refermentation, but I haven't heard of the k-meta?

What is it for and why do we need it??

Also, do you usually add the f-pack to the first racking coming out of secondary?...or do you usually wait until the wine is clear, then add it, then rack again until clear?

Thanks in advance for your help! (...and patience) ;)
 

Rocky

Chronologically Gifted Member
WMT Supporter
Joined
Jan 29, 2011
Messages
6,091
Reaction score
2,084
Location
Columbus, OH
Okay, newbie here... I've got plum and peach wines in secondary right now. Hubby and I were talking about f-packs...not sure if we'll need to make them or not for a future racking, but reading up on how to make them "just in case". What is this "k-meta" I'm reading about?? We've got the potassium sorbate and I know that is to prevent refermentation, but I haven't heard of the k-meta?

What is it for and why do we need it??

Also, do you usually add the f-pack to the first racking coming out of secondary?...or do you usually wait until the wine is clear, then add it, then rack again until clear?

Thanks in advance for your help! (...and patience) ;)
K-meta is Potassium Metabisulfite (K2S2O5) and is a wine preservative and sanitizer for wine making equipment and containers. Here is a glossary entry for K-meta from another site:

Potassium Metabisulfite (K-Meta)
Potassium metabisulfite is added to wine to inhibit bacteria and yeast growth, as well as slow down oxidation. It may leave an unpleasant aftertaste in wine if the dose is too high. This chemical is also used in a water solution as an antiseptic rinse to sanitize equipment. It is identical to, but better than, Sodium Metabisulfite, because it does not add sodium to one's diet. CAUTION: Some people, particularly asthmatics, can have a severe allergic reaction to this substance.
Use: For wine: 1/8 teaspoon (1 gram) of powder per gallon of wine provides 150 ppm free SO2. A little bit goes a long way, so be careful! Always test the free S02 content of your wine (using Titrets and Titret holder) to determine the proper amount to add. Generally speaking, the target free SO2 for red wines is 20-30 ppm and 25-40 ppm for white wines. The exact target depends upon the pH of the wine.
For sanitizing solution: Dissolve 2 oz. (3 tablespoons) Potassium Metabisulfite powder in one gallon of water to make a 1.25% solution.

Regarding f-packs, when you add them is variable. If you add them during fermentation, they will add body and taste and possibly more alcohol to the wine. If you add them after fermentation and stabilization, they will add body and taste and could add sweetness to the wine. It is a matter of preference and taste. I have added them during both periods. I also occasionally ferment to dry in the primary fermenter by snapping down the lid and adding an airlock when the SG gets to about 1.010-1.020.
 

Tom

Senior Member
Joined
Nov 6, 2006
Messages
11,356
Reaction score
95
F-pac = Flavor pac
That being said I add after wine is stabilized (adding k-meta and sorbate). Reason is you will cloud you wine so why clear and than add and start all over again.
 

Rocky

Chronologically Gifted Member
WMT Supporter
Joined
Jan 29, 2011
Messages
6,091
Reaction score
2,084
Location
Columbus, OH
Good point Tom, I like to add the f-pack as early in the process as possible, but sometimes I don't realize I need or decide to use an f-pack until the wine is stabilized and cleared.
 

Tom

Senior Member
Joined
Nov 6, 2006
Messages
11,356
Reaction score
95
Then you didn't "taste" it soon enough...
 

Rocky

Chronologically Gifted Member
WMT Supporter
Joined
Jan 29, 2011
Messages
6,091
Reaction score
2,084
Location
Columbus, OH
I probably tasted it all along the way. It is a multi-step process for me: Tasting, evaluating, developing alternatives, choosing an alternative, obtaining the materials and implementing. All this time, the clock is running on the wine and that determines the point of intersection of the two processes. If the wine has to clear again, so be it. I am retired and have lots of time. :)
 

joeswine

joeswine
Joined
Nov 15, 2007
Messages
7,027
Reaction score
1,251
To each their own

IF I WERE A FPAC WHEN TO GO IN IM SO CONFUSSED:)

ACTUALLY THE CORRECT FPAC INTERACION IS AT THE END AFTER ALL IS SAID AND DONE,IF YOU WERE USING ZEST ,THEN IN THE SECONDARY AN THIRD STAGES, IF YOUR WERE ADDIND RASINS IN THE SECONDARY,IF YOU WERE ADDING GRAPE PACT IN THE PRIMARY BUT A FPAC IN THE FINAL STATEMENT YOUR ADDING TO A ALREADY FINISHED WINE OR A A FLAVOR ENHANCER OR BLENDED COMPONENT TO COMPLEMENT OR CREATE A NEW FLAVOR PROFILE...AT LEAST THATS MY THOUGHTS..:iAND IT ALL DEPENDS ON WHAT YOU THINK A FPAC IS?:br
 

PCharles

Senior Member
Joined
Apr 22, 2011
Messages
460
Reaction score
8
Dilution effect of an F-pac

Good day friends,

I'm wondering about the dilution effect of an f-pac on wine. If you start with 6 gallons and add 1 gallon of f-pack would not the fine alcohol be reduced from 12% to something like 10%?

I realize one might fortify wine with brandy to compensate, but am interested in other strategies.

Thanks,

Paul
 

Sirs

just an oldman
Joined
Aug 5, 2010
Messages
1,335
Reaction score
15
to me a gallon of f-pac is a lot well to me to much, why would any wine need that much of an f-pac unless your doing a second run using just skins possibly? if nothing else keep reducing it down to maybe a quart then it won't make any real noticable difference in the ABV
 

ffemt128

Senior Member
WMT Supporter
Joined
Dec 28, 2009
Messages
5,254
Reaction score
554
Good day friends,

I'm wondering about the dilution effect of an f-pac on wine. If you start with 6 gallons and add 1 gallon of f-pack would not the fine alcohol be reduced from 12% to something like 10%?

I realize one might fortify wine with brandy to compensate, but am interested in other strategies.

Thanks,

Paul
If you are starting with a gallon of juice for an fpac, you would simmer this down to below 1/2 gallon probably closer to 1/3rd of a gallon so as not to dilute the wine as much but yet maximize your flavor addition.
 

PCharles

Senior Member
Joined
Apr 22, 2011
Messages
460
Reaction score
8
Why a gallon

Sirs, the gallon figure was used for example. Howerver, the procedure for an f-pac suggests keeping back 1/3 of the fruit. If I was using 5 gallons of fruit, 1/3 of that is 1.66 gallons. If this was simmered down, it's not hard to see how it would give you close to a gallon of juice right?
 

joeswine

joeswine
Joined
Nov 15, 2007
Messages
7,027
Reaction score
1,251
Fpac thoughts

i AGREE WITH SIRS, WHY WOULD YOU NEED SO MUCH IN THE FIRST PLACE, THAT WOULD BE MY FIRST THOUGHTS,AND THEN AGAIN WHAT TYPE OF FPAC ARE WE TAKLKING ABOUT JUICE,FRUIT,OR ?:d

I READ THE ABOVE STATEMENT AND IT WASN'T CLEAR TO ME IF YOU WERE MAKING A FRUIT FPAC AND SAY USING BLACKBERRYS THEN 5-6 LBS.PER GAL. AND THEN THE FPAC ANOTHER 3TO 5LBS OF FRUIT COOKED DOWN SLITELY ,BUT i MAY HAVE NOT UNDERSTOOD THE QUESTION CLEARLY SORRY.
 
Last edited:

Tom

Senior Member
Joined
Nov 6, 2006
Messages
11,356
Reaction score
95
I been using fresh F-pacs and at most I add 1+ quarts. Remember f-pac is for adding flavor. Yes the alcohol will be reduced but.. SO WHAT! The purpose is making a better more flavorable fruit wine.
 

PCharles

Senior Member
Joined
Apr 22, 2011
Messages
460
Reaction score
8
f-pac question

The procedure for an f-pac suggests putting aside 30% of the fruit. If I add 6 gallons of fruit to a six gallon batch, I'd be setting aside 1.8 gallons of fruit. I figure that would be reduced by about 60% through processing and reduction. This would be about .7 gallons. Tom's comment about using 1+ quart would be less than that. I like the jelly suggestion made by another member. This would provide lots of flavor with very little volume.

My question originated from an experience I had with a blueberry wine that I made. I added about .5 gallons of 100% blueberry juice to 5.5 gallons of wine. I find that the punch of my strawberry wine is greater than that of the blueberry wine. I didn't add an f-pac to the strawberry wine. Looking back, the supposed 100% juice may not have been as it was stated. Perhaps it would have been better for me to have used frozen fruit that I rendered on my own. Next time I'll make my own f-pac material (or perhaps use the jam approach). I most certainly will concentrate the f-pac material with volume to wine at about 4-6% of total wine volume. This would reduce alcohol from 12% to 11.4%.
 

Tom

Senior Member
Joined
Nov 6, 2006
Messages
11,356
Reaction score
95
1st you do not add 6 gallons of fruit to make 6 gallons of wine. You add #'s of fruit. That being said if you used 30#'s of fruit for 6 gallons of WINE then you SIMMER 6#'s of fruit for a f-pac. No way will you add 1+gallons of juice.
Now if you are adding "juice" you need to simmer it down to remove the water. All you want is the thick syrup.
 

Sirs

just an oldman
Joined
Aug 5, 2010
Messages
1,335
Reaction score
15
to me if you add enough fruit/grapes and less water to begin with you shouldn't really need an F-pac I mean it isn't like all the flavor just evaporates, the flavor most of the time isn't gone it's the sweetness that's not there if you have the proper amount of sweetness then there should be plenty of flavor.All fruits/grapes don't have to be sweet to taste right and thats where the drier wines come into play
 

PCharles

Senior Member
Joined
Apr 22, 2011
Messages
460
Reaction score
8
Simmer to syrup

Ok, simmer to syrup. Doing that, dilution would be considerably less. I've only added an f-pac once. I didn't simmer to syrup, and the wine was diluted more than I would have liked. I usually ferment dry and leave it like that. I'm sure I'll try an f-pac again, but will not make the same error of not simmering to thick syrup.
 

Sirs

just an oldman
Joined
Aug 5, 2010
Messages
1,335
Reaction score
15
long as you simmer slowly with no high heat it should reduce down fairly easy, just keep a check that its not sticking or burning to the bottom
 

PCharles

Senior Member
Joined
Apr 22, 2011
Messages
460
Reaction score
8
Burning Your Bottom

long as you simmer slowly with no high heat it should reduce down fairly easy, just keep a check that its not sticking or burning to the bottom
Hey Sirs, I agree,

That reminds me of another way to burn your bottom. Eating jalapeño and Habanero peppers will burn your bottom and set it on fire too. :tz

Sorry, sometimes I can't help myself.

Have a great day,

Paul
 

joeswine

joeswine
Joined
Nov 15, 2007
Messages
7,027
Reaction score
1,251
the body and structure of wine

SIRS,if you are making grape wine then the fruit should be up front ,remember when good wines gone bad,grape wines should have the structure built in, in the begining no fpacs required unless you need to adjust a little wih flavor,and tannins,,fruit wines on the other hand can be adjusted at anytime,and the fpac should always be extra fruit prepared ahead or when needed ,With grape juice the body should be in the fruit ,if the fruit is quaility then the body will show up if the fruit is not so great or doesn't have enough acidy or sugar then the body of the wine from the beginning is not going to be there,remember the zest,and the concentrates,at times with juice wines they come into play nicely,.

I also talked about layering tannins into the wine which ever you chose to use cubes,spirels,chips and powdered,this inthemselves will deliver the tannic mouth feel to gain ground on body,layering them is the key,look once again at all the components coming with the high end kits ,there all designed to deliver a good tasteing product but more than that they build body and structure and that is just what there designed to do,the tannins from the oak,lend acity the smoothness of the powder delivers mouth feel,the balance of the sugar and all the combind elements are the structure and the body of wine.
always remember wine comes in 3 different styles (for a better word) thin is a body,med is a body and full ,wine can be broken down into its many facets....thats what the body and structure of wine will go into...sorry didn't mean to get on my soap box...tepe is right and knows fpacs very well......sirs did you get my pm?
 
2

Latest posts

Top