Green Mist Vineyard - The OFFICIAL Startup Thread

[TimTheWiner]

Well it is official. I have decided to make the LEAP from kits to vines. Not kits to grapes, but kits to vines. I have only been in the hobby for less than a year with only 4 kit wines under my belt. I yearn for more am passionate about reaching the next level. Now one would assume go to fresh local grapes, which I absolutely plan to do this fall, however I know that in the long run I will only be truly satisfied if I am making everything from scratch and I do mean vine to bottle. There is still much to learn, but with it being a 3+ year period before I have a fruitful yield, I figure I might as well get started now on planting and that will give me plenty of time to hone my skills perfecting the actual winemaking.

The land I am using will be about a 1/4 acre field, with which I plan on utilizing about a 80'x80' plantable area. We are in USDA winter hardiness Zone 6a, and will be purchasing vines from Double A Vineyards by October. I plan on planting Cabernet Franc and Riesling (and possibly one or two other undetermined varietals). The lot appears to get good sun exposure (at least 5-6 hours of direct light per day May-Sept), and gently slopes towards the woods which will aid in an eventual gravity fed drip irrigation system (via rainwater collection).

Although I thought of the name (this will be a non-commercial operation), my father takes credit for coining the term. He always described the "green mist" in the woods during those few very early weeks of spring when the buds are just barely starting to break on the trees and shrubbery in the forest behind the house, and all you see is a see of a fine green mist in and otherwise brown and lifeless forest. I will look forward to this journey and hope you will enjoy my updates and pictures of the progression. I will be keeping questions that I have to the search feature, or separate threads. Enjoy!

 

[TimTheWiner]

Here is the field for the vineyard. It is actually larger than the pictures make it look. All these pics are from my iphone camera, but will be using my Canon in the future.

View from the woods, may need to clear a few trees before planting. Quite shaded at 5 pm.

View from road/entrance.

 

[TimTheWiner]

First ground breaking. Hit a rock just below the surface and in MANY locations. I have a feeling I will be spending the next two months just prepping the soil and removing any large rocks down to about 24".

Soil sample is ready to head to Uconn (taken from 5 sites at 8"-12").

 

[ibglowin]

That looks like dirt dude......

You are ahead of me already if you got dirt!

Looks like a putting green.

Looking forward to your progress!

 

[TimTheWiner]

Looks like a putting green.

Lol, yeh certainly nothing too see yet but gotta start somewhere. I will start laying out perimeter and row lines with string tomorrow and begin tilling next weekend.

 

[TimTheWiner]

Here is an aerial of the field. You can see there is quite a bit of afternoon shade (I believe this photo would've been taken sometime around 4 pm during the summer). And a tad concerned since there is visible moss cover along with the grass on that corner/side of the field, so I really need to see how much direct light will be on the vines and if I need to cut down any trees.

 

[heatrash4]

Here is an aerial of the field. You can see there is quite a bit of afternoon shade (I believe this photo would've been taken sometime around 4 pm during the summer). And a tad concerned since there is visible moss cover along with the grass on that corner/side of the field, so I really need to see how much direct light will be on the vines and if I need to cut down any trees.

I would love to do what you are doing! Keep it up, I am very interested to see your progress .

 

[TimTheWiner]

Spent almost 3 hours today sweating it out getting the exact crop area/perimeter mapped staked out. The pain was more mental than physical since I was using math, degrees, and angles that I haven't thought of in 10+ years. I wanted to get the 4 corners set and perfectly square. It is hard enough to get a perfect square that looks like it has equal borders on all edges (ie: looking parallel to property lines for aesthetics), but to boot, I decided to take it a step further. I read an excerpt of an article that shows that if rows are set North/South but 15 degrees West of North it aids in more even fruit ripening. Well I got LUCKY. It just so happens that the road/property line run almost EXACTLY 15 degrees West of north, so I basically stood in the yellow line in the middle of the road and measured into the field from there to achieve this parallel line, and amazing 15 degree angle (actually considered 345 degrees). I have a pic below from Google Maps, and here is the test excerpt from the article (site requires a membership which is why I didn't use a hyperlink):

Row Direction in Cooler Climates
With the restriction of midday sun exposure lifted, row orientation may be chosen to maximize viticultural characteristics. Fruit temperature is a key (perhaps the key) factor in the ripening process. For highest wine quality, our goal is to have fruit achieve ripeness (flavor, not just sugar) at the same time. Therefore, we want to promote uniformity of fruit ripening processes for both sides of the canopy. That means that fruit on each side should experience similar temperature cycles each day. At first blush, one would think that the best way to achieve this is with a north-south row orientation. After all, they both will receive the same amount of sunshine. Indeed, a north-south row orientation will come close to this ideal. But, take a look at the fruit temperature measurements made for the north-south row in Chart B. The east side fruit, exposed to the sun's rays in the morning, heats up and reaches peak temperature well before noon. The west side fruit, shaded until after solar noon, peaks in temperature in the mid-afternoon. But notice that the temperature curves are not symmetrical. If we did a heat summation on the two curves, the east-facing side would have been seen to have received more "degree-hours." In other words, the north-south row orientation does not achieve the ideal goal of equitable heat exposure of the two sides of the canopy.
The reason for this discrepancy is that grape berries are mostly water and water has a high heat capacity. In other words, it takes a lot of energy to raise berry temperature to a given level, and by the same token, berry temperature tends to resist changes, including cooling. This can be thought of as akin to "thermal momentum." Because of this thermal momentum, the east-side fruit that warms up under the direct morning sunshine remains relatively warm during the afternoon, even though it is no longer in the sun. This is because the ambient temperature continues to increase, and fruit temperature will not fall until the ambient temperature falls below fruit temperature.
On the other hand, the west-facing fruit does not experience sunshine until after noon, at which time its temperature rises above ambient. But because of thermal momentum, its temperature does not peak until an hour or two later than the ambient temperature peak. Once the west-facing fruit temperature peaks, the ambient air temperature is well past its peak and its temperature does not remain elevated like that of the east-facing fruit. Therefore, to account for this small, but significant, discrepancy, row direction should be oriented about 10 to 15 degrees west of north (i.e., 345-350°) in cool climates. This is just an educated guess, and I have not determined the ideal row orientation as it would require some advanced modeling or some additional field research. Nevertheless, I will assume that most situations in cool climates can get away with a north-south orientation, especially since many parcel boundaries are laid out in that direction. But the slight jog towards the west should be a consideration for vineyard installations attempting to maximize uniformity of ripeness in their vineyards.
^Source: http://www.winebusiness.com/wbm/?go=getArticle&dataId=58458

 

[TimTheWiner]

Really crappy phone pic, and I promise the last. Quite hard to make out the square as I made it close to the ground so it will be easier to spray paint X's over marking row posts. Again looks MUCH better and bigger in person. I have decided to go with 6' row spacing as I feel there will still be plenty of space with it mostly being handwork/no machinery, and little shadowing from neighboring canopies. Might consider adding one more row to the left side of the screen, or move the whole square to the left side by maybe 6' and more away from the woods.

And I threw this together on some graphing paper so everything is to scale.

 

[Wade E]

Would love to check it out when the grapes are in!

 

[TimTheWiner]

2 more hours in the vineyard (to be) today. Got all the rows measured and sprayed. The "V" rows are vines (3 feet wide) with a 3 foot grass path in between each. Hopefully will start tilling next weekend.

 

[fivebk]

You should probably have at least a 10 foot spacing between the rows ( better airflow, circulation, & more sunlight )
Just something I read and was told. The vines should be no closer that 6ft in the row 8ft would be better.

BOB

 

[TimTheWiner]

You should probably have at least a 10 foot spacing between the rows ( better airflow, circulation, & more sunlight )

Originally was going to do 6 foot vine spacing by 8 foot row spacing. Decided on 5 foot because Double A recommends 4'-6' and it worked well with my 60' length and mid post spacing. As far as row spacing, I read numerous threads and google articles and most stating 8' rows were more concerned with larger farm equipment fitting, and most sites stated that 6' spacing is acceptable for backyard vineyards with little mechanical equipment, plus light models I have seen don't show a serious shadowing problem until less than 6'. Could be better, but I really wanting the 50+ quantity pricing per vine of $3.60 vs less than 49 quantity being $7 each, so I needed to fit 100+ as well.

 

[grapeman]

You really don't need to try to fit more in than you really want to just get a price break. The quantity 50, unless than changed it, is for the total order not each variety.

 

[TimTheWiner]

The quantity 50, unless than changed it, is for the total order not each variety.

Good to know, I just didn't think that the vine and row spacing was that bad. I wanted enough quantity to be able to share with large extended family as well. I am estimating 300-350 bottles per year, and planning on having about 100 per year for myself.

 

[ibglowin]

So enquiring minds want to know why you chose those two varietals? :>

 

[TimTheWiner]

Well, I really just went by what I like. I see they are rated up to zone 6a cold hardiness which puts me on edge a bit. I mapped it down to the exact coordinates on the USDA site, and the are is just over the border from 6b to 6a, but I think I would feel a little better if I just went with something rated more like zone 4 or 5, just to play it on the safe side if we have a really bad winter. I like do like Cabernet Franc, but I have seen a bit of criticism on the forums to where people think it's used more for blending than anything else. I do enjoy Riesling quite a bit as well. I spoke to Double A on the phone today, and they mentioned I might try Cayuga, Noiret, or Marquette. I have a little time to decide, but I would like to order by Octoberish.

 

[ibglowin]

Cab Franc if done right is amazing stuff, but Cab Franc if not fully ripened smells and taste like a big BAD green bell pepper. Not good! I can tell you this. I am growing Marquette and have tasted several bottles of Marquette from Hid in Pines one of our Sponsors and it is without a doubt as good as any Pinot Noir I have ever had. If you have not tried any Marquette do so! It is cold hardy down to ~-30. I fear you will be replanting every 5-10 years if you do go with vinifera noble. Le Crescent is another cold hardy hybrid (white) that taste like a cross between Riesling and Sauv Blanc. These are not your grandfathers cold hardy hybrids these are "state of the art" hybrids that can stand up to any vinifera noble IMHO. They are worth investigating if you have not done so.

 

[TimTheWiner]

Ok thanks for the insight. I think I will plan on visiting and/or calling at least 10 local vineyards and pick their brains a bit as well about what will work well around here. I think I may end up needed to tweak my vine spacing a bit, but better to think about it now. I will have to look for Le Crescent as well, sounds good.

 

[grapeman]

Here is a link to it at Double A
http://www.doubleavineyards.com/p-716-lacrescent-mn-1166.aspx

And the University of Minnesota where it was developed.
http://www.grapes.umn.edu/lac/index.html

I haven't commented on varieties yet because I think we all need to decide what we like, but when Iasked, I will give my opinions on them as I have tried most varieites at one time or another.