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sour_grapes

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I wasn't making a point! Just observing.

Actually, I think you NEEDED to say it the way you said it in your post. For the joke to work, you couldn't say the word "gas," so you needed to use a term that signified you meant gasoline. "Summer blend" by itself wouldn't quite cut it. "Unleaded summer blend" was perfect.
 

mainshipfred

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I was really happy when posts got on the lighter, less political side and all those charts and graphs are not showing up as much. Perhaps people are now realizing they didn't depict truly accurate information.
 

mainshipfred

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Not clear what you mean by that. Which graphs do you feel were inaccurate?
All along I've been trying to stay out of this thread although at times it has been very hard. When I referred to political I wasn't referring to governmental politics but rather differing opinions of ones views of a topic, in this case COVID 19. Perhaps inaccurate may not be the best word but rather inconclusive, ambiguous or equivocal but nonetheless there is reason to question the results.

The political correct thing to say about the deaths is no death is acceptable, or the like, but the fact is people are going to die from this. My issue is how the deaths are reported and I just can't accept probable. Then they say people that die at home are not always counted and the numbers may be higher so my question is why are they not. There is much literature out the that tell how deaths from this or other causes are determined and it varies from State to State, so what parameters are they using. As far as probable goes there are causes of death that have the same or similar symptoms and my understanding is the probable count is done without testing just similar symptoms. Also just because someone dies with these symptoms and shows positive for COVID 19, was the death directly related to having it or underlying conditions. The lack of standards makes the death count questionable.

The number of new cases is also questionable and is directly related to the number of tests given so I don't see the growth rate charts as definitive. There will be more cases as time progresses but the growth rate chart would not be as vertical as it indicates if a similar amount of test were given in the beginning as are given now. What does the number of confirmed cases really indicate? So what is someone is confirmed positive if they show little or no or even moderate symptoms, there are far more cases with these results as not.

One thing that can't be debated is we just don't know enough about this pandemic to have any answers that are not to some degree speculative or questionable. This is only my take on the situation and not my intention to enter into a debate. Everyone has the right to their opinion. My Mom had a great saying when things like this would come up "why do you think God gave us a brain".
 

GreginND

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I posted the following on my Facebook feed and thought I would share it here. Common sense has gone out the window. I think the main problem is having rules without really educating the public about why a rule is there and what risk it is mitigating (or not). My fear that the general public that had been just resisting the blanket mandates now swing 180 degrees when restrictions are lifted to think the rule is gone, so back to normal is being realized in my state. Anyway, read if you want . . .

----- Posted 5-22-2020


So, most of you probably know that I have been a proponent of taking things slowly and waiting to understand this virus more before "letting 'er rip". But, I think some misunderstand me. For many reasons I have a problem with one size fits all arbitrary government mandates. In a number of states, businesses and churches are complaining about certain restrictions on them operating. I have to admit that some of the executive orders by politicians are not applicable for every place across a state.

For example, in some states there is an absolute number restriction that nothing can have more than 50 people. What if a venue has acres of space that you could easily spread out 200 people 100 feet apart? Is that less safe than putting 10 people at one table in a restaurant? It doesn’t make sense; common, scientific or medical. It is not hard to craft guidelines that are aligned with the actual risks. Arbitrary numbers made up by politicians are not what is needed. That actually creates a false security for those places where 50 would be 40 people too many.

Another example - some states closed all golf courses. What could be safer than having people out in fresh air, getting some exercise, and being hundreds of yards away from other golfers? We need sun and vitamin D right now. The only thing here that needed to be shut down was the nineteenth hole.

Guidelines should reflect the appropriate distancing, ppe, etc, but then be flexible to adapt to each unique space. Why is that so hard? A rule that says if you are within 10 feet of anyone outside of your family bubble, you need a mask, is reasonable. Even if people decide they are ok with higher risks than others, a reasonable guideline is to make sure businesses only allow groups who choose to congregate, to have adequate distance from other customers and staff. All we can do is provide a safe space for customers to chose where they are safe and comfortable. We can do this safely with some smart common sense. We should continue to educate the public with facts and science and convince them what works to minimize risks. And only mandate that which provides businesses with guidance and assurance that they can enforce their safety guidelines based on those facts.

I have rambled on too much. I hope you understand what I am saying here. Keep washing hands, distancing and wearing your masks to protect others when you are close.

-----
 

GreginND

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FYI - the "Let 'er rip" comment came from my governor's press conference yesterday. He basically told the public all restrictions are no longer in place and the guidelines are "suggestions". They actually said "Let 'er rip". There will be no enforcement, no accountability. This right after our numbers are spiking to their highest levels yet and continue an exponential climb. Especially in my county were Fargo is . . we have a large fraction of the cases.
 

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Given the seriousness of the illness on some people and the ease of spread is it really too much to expect people to wear a face mask until we get a vaccine? Years ago a friend in Japan sent a picture and I noticed a few people wearing surgical masks. It's 'been a thing' there for a long time with some people. Afraid God won't recognize you in church if you are wearing a mask and she won't credit you with being there?
 

ibglowin

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I feel like this country is broken beyond repair. If we can't come together as one to fight a worldwide pandemic we're pretty much effed as a nation. This has sadly now become a battle between the mask wearers and the AR15 toting, State capital storming, Pandemic deniers.....
 

1d10t

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I feel like this country is broken beyond repair. If we can't come together as one to fight a worldwide pandemic we're pretty much effed as a nation. This has sadly now become a battle between the mask wearers and the AR15 toting, State capital storming, Pandemic deniers.....
Which makes you feel safer or offers more protection now? An N95 or an AR15?
 

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Well our daughter is officially quarantined and scared and angry and pissed. She's an assistant manager at a restaurant and had a manager living with family members who were exposed. The manager kept going into work without telling anyone. Her family members then tested positive and this manager still went to work until finally being contacted by the local health department, tested, found to be positive and then quarantined. In the mean time Emma has followed all guidelines religiously and is probably not infected. She went to be tested today and was told to just go home and isolate for 14 days. If symptoms show they will test her, if not they won't. Does not seem like much of a help to us. In the mean time she has a 4 year old baby and a husband that she worries she could have exposed because of the actions of this manager. In addition there are all of the other employees and patrons that visited when that manager was on duty. We have to assume and hope that the masking and sanitizing rules in effect at the restaurant minimized the chances but will have to wait and see.

So, in this case, a N95 would have made me, my wife, our daughter and her entire family feel much safer than an AR15.

Mike
 

ibglowin

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And that is just plain BS. She should be tested. Not sure what State she lives in I think you mentioned WI but not sure. Here in NM anyone who wants a test can and will be tested. She falls into the category of being possibly exposed by a coworker so she should be tested immediately and without hesitation.

NM is now approaching 8% of the State population being tested.

She went to be tested today and was told to just go home and isolate for 14 days. If symptoms show they will test her, if not they won't. Does not seem like much of a help to us.
 

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And that is just plain BS. She should be tested. Not sure what State she lives in I think you mentioned WI but not sure. Here in NM anyone who wants a test can and will be tested. She falls into the category of being possibly exposed by a coworker so she should be tested immediately and without hesitation.

NM is now approaching 8% of the State population being tested.
Here in NH, anyone can get tested for the active virus and for antibodies. My wife and I were both tested and all tests were negative. I would have liked to have a lot of antibodies, but no such luck!
 

Kraffty

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Yeah, I got fired up and Lori, while on the phone with Em, kept saying "she's dealing directly with the health department". Great...... and yes it's WI
What I don't get is a basic lack of common sense in so much of this.
Mike
 

Boatboy24

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Well our daughter is officially quarantined and scared and angry and pissed. She's an assistant manager at a restaurant and had a manager living with family members who were exposed. The manager kept going into work without telling anyone. Her family members then tested positive and this manager still went to work until finally being contacted by the local health department, tested, found to be positive and then quarantined. In the mean time Emma has followed all guidelines religiously and is probably not infected. She went to be tested today and was told to just go home and isolate for 14 days. If symptoms show they will test her, if not they won't. Does not seem like much of a help to us. In the mean time she has a 4 year old baby and a husband that she worries she could have exposed because of the actions of this manager. In addition there are all of the other employees and patrons that visited when that manager was on duty. We have to assume and hope that the masking and sanitizing rules in effect at the restaurant minimized the chances but will have to wait and see.

So, in this case, a N95 would have made me, my wife, our daughter and her entire family feel much safer than an AR15.

Mike
While I can certainly understand that some people must work, that is ridiculous. And there should be penalties for knowingly exposing dozens (or more) to a deadly disease. Hopefully, Emma is not infected and can confirm that with a test so a little peace of mind can be had.
 

sour_grapes

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That is a real shame, Mike. Yes, that person was beyond irresponsible.

I cannot recall where you said your daughter lives. In my area, testing sites are now available. This page shows current testing sites statewide (but if she is working with the Health Dept., my page is probably not necessary). COVID-19: How to get tested
 
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