Clearing Apple vs. Peach?

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bkisel

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What's up with this...?

I've now got 3 peach and 3 apple wine from raw cider fermentations under my belt. All three apple wines have cleared quickly and easily with the addition of one tsp pectic enzyme and the use of one application of SuperKleer. I can literally within just a few hours see the apple wine clearing. My peach wines on the other hand are a bear to get cleared. I do as I do with the apple and get hardly any clearing until after several months hitting it again with enzyme and SuperKleer. The second clearing application thankfully has done the trick with the peach but why is it so much more difficult to clear than my apple? Before stabilization, degassing and clearing my apple looks as dense, maybe even more so, than my peach. It doesn't make sense to me.

These two pictures of my apple were taken today just several short hours apart. Note all the sediment already forming at the bottom of the carboy...

.

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FTC Wines

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Bill, we make a lot of Apple & Peach wine. Our Apple always clears way before the peach. I now use more Petic enz in the primary of the peach, but it still takes longer. Some years almost 9 months. Haven't used clearing agents other than time. Roy
 

bkisel

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Bill, we make a lot of Apple & Peach wine. Our Apple always clears way before the peach. I now use more Petic enz in the primary of the peach, but it still takes longer. Some years almost 9 months. Haven't used clearing agents other than time. Roy
Okay, so it is just not me. But why? Probably a bunch of chemistry involved that I'd not understand even if explained to me.

Do you have a wine making business or just a hobby?
 
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salcoco

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peach wine and even pear wine clearing is difficult because of proteins in the wine. the best tactic to use is add betonite in the juice prior to fermenting just as it is done with wine kits.
The betonite particles bind with the proteins during fermentation and help clear the wine.
you can also add betonite post fermentation. rack and then use super Kleer.
 

bkisel

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peach wine and even pear wine clearing is difficult because of proteins in the wine. the best tactic to use is add betonite in the juice prior to fermenting just as it is done with wine kits.
The betonite particles bind with the proteins during fermentation and help clear the wine.
you can also add betonite post fermentation. rack and then use super Kleer.
So I guess the peach proteins bind tighter than the apple proteins, right?

That's exactly what I do! Apple starts clearing immediately and is very clear in just a few days - ready to be racked off the sediment to a clean carboy for 2 months bulk aging.. Peach on the other hand has not cleared for me without a second hit of enzyme and SuperKleer. My time frame for fruit wines is to bottle after about 2 months of bulk aging.

My apple wine (batch #1 not #2 that you see in OP) on the left cleared to what you see in 4-5 days after stabilization, etc. and racked just yesterday for bulk aging. The peach you see on the right was racked for bulk aging on 9/19/2016. It will be hit a second time for clearing and if it goes like my other peach batches will finally clear.

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hounddawg

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try pear pectin, as for me like the other said 9 to 12 months work best for me as well, with no finings,,, and pear is much worse, that i wait fm 18 months o 24 months, but well worth it to me, time is a humans enemy but time is wines best friend,,,
Dawg



What's up with this...?

I've now got 3 peach and 3 apple wine from raw cider fermentations under my belt. All three apple wines have cleared quickly and easily with the addition of one tsp pectic enzyme and the use of one application of SuperKleer. I can literally within just a few hours see the apple wine clearing. My peach wines on the other hand are a bear to get cleared. I do as I do with the apple and get hardly any clearing until after several months hitting it again with enzyme and SuperKleer. The second clearing application thankfully has done the trick with the peach but why is it so much more difficult to clear than my apple? Before stabilization, degassing and clearing my apple looks as dense, maybe even more so, than my peach. It doesn't make sense to me.

These two pictures of my apple were taken today just several short hours apart. Note all the sediment already forming at the bottom of the carboy...

.
 

bkisel

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try pear pectin, as for me like the other said 9 to 12 months work best for me as well, with no finings,,, and pear is much worse, that i wait fm 18 months o 24 months, but well worth it to me, time is a humans enemy but time is wines best friend,,,
Dawg
I hear you Dawg but just no way I'm waiting that long before enjoying my country wines. I'll bulk age them 2 mo. and bottle age them 2 and they're always good to go - sooner if I want to push it.
 

stickman

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I'm no expert in this area, but I noticed that peaches have around 3 times the protein content of apples. There is some natural tannin in both peaches and apples, and tannin does aid in the precipitation of proteins, so it may be that in the case of apples, there is enough natural tannin to precipitate the smaller protein content. As far as pectin is concerned, in general, peaches are indicated as having lower pectin content versus apples, though I'm sure it depends to some extent on the particular variety and level of ripeness etc. It may be worth conducting a bench trial tannin addition to the peach wine to see if clarification is faster.
 

bkisel

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I'm no expert in this area, but I noticed that peaches have around 3 times the protein content of apples. There is some natural tannin in both peaches and apples, and tannin does aid in the precipitation of proteins, so it may be that in the case of apples, there is enough natural tannin to precipitate the smaller protein content. As far as pectin is concerned, in general, peaches are indicated as having lower pectin content versus apples, though I'm sure it depends to some extent on the particular variety and level of ripeness etc. It may be worth conducting a bench trial tannin addition to the peach wine to see if clarification is faster.
What you posted makes sense and would explain the difference. So far though, I've just needed to hit the peach with another dose of pectin enzyme and a second application of SuperKleer. I can live with that. The end result still tastes great.
 

hounddawg

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that bulk aging is without pear pectin, i use no fining or speeding up agents in mine, pear pectin help clear pear much faster and so far pear is the slowest clearing,
Dawg


I hear you Dawg but just no way I'm waiting that long before enjoying my country wines. I'll bulk age them 2 mo. and bottle age them 2 and they're always good to go - sooner if I want to push it.
 

lisanordmann

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I also have 2 - 5 gallon carboys of peach wine not clearing. I only added 1 tsp of pectic enzyme at the beginning of fermentation. I also added bentonite after fermentation which did nothing. On dec 6 i added dual Klear which has had very little impact. I also have 1 gallon that i did not add the dual klear but added sparkoloid that is actually clearing. Should i just wait this out or should i add sparkloid. What if i added pectic enzymes at this point.
 

cintipam

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Add more pectic enzyme. Some fruits are way higher in pectin than others, and I usually use double or slightly more pectic enzyme for my first dose. Adding it later takes more to be effective, but it will not change your taste or cause you any problem. A few fruits that are high in pectin are peach, strawberry, and gooseberry.

Pam in cinti
 
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