Other woods?

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Has anybody ever experimented with using other woods besides oak in their wine? It seems to me that we've learned historically that oak is a great flavor in wine as a side effect of it being used for barrels. But does that mean that other woods have nothing to add flavor wise even if they are not as water tight? Now that we can make cubes and staves and such, why not other woods?
I am thinking about experimenting with apple and cherry, but would think that other mild smoking woods would be worth trying as well..
 
I had this exact conversation yesterday with my wife. I hope someone has an answer to this.
I am curious as well!
 
I cannot testify to what other wood would do to a wine (something I've always wondered myself), but I can tell you that the process for preparing your own wood (smoking etc.) is VERY difficult and length taking years to complete. This is based on my own research and other conversations I've seen.
 
Just about any hard wood could be used.
I have seen chestnut and maple being used with great success.

Stay away from pine (where the sap is more or less turpentine) or any "soft wood any you should be fine.
 
I think the process (dry aging etc) should be very similar to folks who age fruit wood for smoking meats. These folks also know which woods are likely to have mild flavors, since they worry about the same things we do with the smoke (well to some extent). I know that the wood won't be toasted, but I have a few messages out to folks who sell smoking wood to please hand select for me a few varieties and pieces that look cleanest, are aged etc. I will cut a few pieces and experiment on an apple wine I think since it should probably show the character of the wood pretty well.
I'll let you all know how it goes.
Should I torch it at all first? I am leaning towards no- thinking it might be best to simply see the character of the woods in their regular state. What do you all think?
 
I think the process (dry aging etc) should be very similar to folks who age fruit wood for smoking meats. These folks also know which woods are likely to have mild flavors, since they worry about the same things we do with the smoke (well to some extent). I know that the wood won't be toasted, but I have a few messages out to folks who sell smoking wood to please hand select for me a few varieties and pieces that look cleanest, are aged etc. I will cut a few pieces and experiment on an apple wine I think since it should probably show the character of the wood pretty well.
I'll let you all know how it goes.
Should I torch it at all first? I am leaning towards no- thinking it might be best to simply see the character of the woods in their regular state. What do you all think?

Try some pecan if you can get it.

Cut the wood into thin strips and put it in your oven at 375-400 and "kiln dry it" that way, has been suggested. To char it, then use a propane torch and then use steel wool or sandpaper to lightly brush off the loose carbonized deposits, leaving behind the char only.

White oak where I live is cheap, cheap, cheap. I am flooring a cattle trailer with it, and I do intend to process the scraps for use in wines.

I smoke meats, too. Smoking wood is just stacked outside like firewood and air-dried.
 
Box arrived today. I've got pieces of peach, plum, cherry, apricot, apple, and pecan. Ordered from fruitawoodchunks.com . The guy there offered me a sampler pack of woods that he uses for smoking. They are very dry and yet super clean. Taking them later to my friend's garage wood shop to find out what my options are with his tools for getting relatively uniform sizes, then going to torch them lightly with my creme brulee torch.
I have a batch going of apple/blueberry wine that I'm going to break up into 6 single gallon jugs and I'll try a different wood in each.

I'll let you all know how it goes!
 
I use fresh cedar all the time for grilling, and have thought many times about how it would pair with wine ( I was thinking German whites). I thought I was the only one thinking about using wood other than oak, but I guess not.
 
This is an interesting concept. I wouldn't use cedar but I don't have a good reason why. Fruit woods sounds interesting.
At some point I read an article that explained why wine barrels are made from oak. I don't remember all of the details but I do recall this being a longstanding concept stemming from wine being transported via ship. The article indicated that barrels used to be made from all hardwoods. Some woods didn't perform as well as others so they were soon eliminated from the mix by the barrel makers. Consumers of the wine slowly begin to notice that wine from the oak barrels had a better, more distinct flavor, making it a more sought after wine. once the request started coming in for wine from oak barrels it didn't take the minemakers long to realize they should only be storing their wine in oak.
I'm sure I botched the whole article and substituted some of my own thoughts into the story but the concept is still the same.
This concept leaves one hole in the theory, the barrel makers may have eliminated a great wood for ageing wine simply because the wood was undesirable for the barrel. With todays carboys and vat fermentors, we really do not need to be concerned with wood grain, absorption quality, durability, ect. for example, Poplar may be a great flavor in wine but the wood split way to easily for the barrel makers to consider it.

I for one am very interested in your guys results and will be following this thread closely.
Exciting stuff, keep it coming.
 
Sebastiani winery used to use redwood barrels, and still has a collection of carved ones at their winery in Sonoma.
 
Not to disagree with my friend JohnT, but I had a chestnut barrel once (from Canada) and I did not like the taste it imparted to the wine. Then again, that is just my taste and others may have liked it. I should also add that I like a lot of oak in my reds. One man's food is another man's poison.
 
I like oak too, just wondering what else might be good. Apple/ blueberry wine is almost done- 1.020 already, so I'll be trying this soon.
 
Decided to just split these pieces with a knife. Torched them lightly and then noticed they were pretty moist after, so I decided to put them in the oven for a bit. Here they are as I will package them up and wait for the wine. Spoon for size reference.

image-4253443233.jpg
 
Duster's instincts are correct. Don't use resinous wood in your wine. You will regret it. Like pine, cedar is a resinous wood.
 
Not to disagree with my friend JohnT, but I had a chestnut barrel once (from Canada) and I did not like the taste it imparted to the wine. Then again, that is just my taste and others may have liked it. I should also add that I like a lot of oak in my reds. One man's food is another man's poison.

I have a Chinese chesnut tree in my front yard (American chestnut will no longer survive to be old enough to fruit), and people stop and beg me to pick up the nuts in fall. I say have at it, I hate them. :)
 
I'd have to agree with not using pine for sure, but even though it doesn't use the wood, the wine called Retsina uses pine sap to give it a distinctive flavor. It was unintentional at first, but people developed a taste for it, of course.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Retsina
 
The Austrians sometimes use what they call acacia (Robinia pseudoacacia, what we call black locust in the US) barrels for white wines.

The Italians sometimes use European chestnut for barrels, especially very large barrels that aren't expected to impart as much wood flavor to the wine.

Mulberry is a favorite for distilled spirits in the Balkans.

A lot of alternatives are available in Europe. Check the Wilhelm Eder site: http://www.barrel-shop.com/. It's a bit misleading, you have to follow the Oak Barrels link to get to the non-oak alternatives (also).

david_in_ks
 
Decided to just split these pieces with a knife. Torched them lightly and then noticed they were pretty moist after, so I decided to put them in the oven for a bit. Here they are as I will package them up and wait for the wine. Spoon for size reference.

View attachment 8390

These chunks look very charred to me. Are you going to clean them somehow?


Not to disagree with my friend JohnT, but I had a chestnut barrel once (from Canada) and I did not like the taste it imparted to the wine. Then again, that is just my taste and others may have liked it. I should also add that I like a lot of oak in my reds. One man's food is another man's poison.

I tried a Chardonnay that was aged in chestnut barrels a few weeks ago and it was quite interesting. Very different fom oak, and it had a slightly "medicinal" note. The producer used used barrels though. He said fresh barrels would be too dominant in taste.
 
Think they are too charred? They have less than the dark toast Hungarian cubes I bought, but the char is different- more caramelized. Maybe because the wood is younger? The wine they are going into is still clearing so maybe I'll rub some of that off in the meantime.
 

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