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Old 04-20-2017, 06:05 AM   #11
Johnd
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If your wine is still releasing CO2 as you are bottling, unless you intend carbonated wine, your wine is not ready to bottle.
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Old 04-20-2017, 12:10 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vacuumpumpman View Post
The allinonewinepump was designed to be under vacuum and go down the side of the bottle to prevent any foam from agitation of the wine, or any left over CO2.
I now have a precision vacuum release valve which aids in this process by adjusting the vacuum even lower while bottling and keeping better flow control.
I agree with the comment that if your wine is still releasing CO2, it is probably not ready to be bottled, but even if you want the potential of further CO2 release under vacuum during bottling, that would be an argument in favor of 'splash bottling' (a stream straight to the bottom) rather than 'going down the side'.

So why is splash bottling harmful to the wine? Is it the increased 'agitation' that is harmful? Is it increased oxidation (under vacuum)? Is it increased foaming?

If it is primarily increased foaming that is the concern, is the formation of foam itself harmful to the wine or that increased foam can result in inconsistent fill height?

 
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Old 04-20-2017, 05:44 PM   #13
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Thin film degassing...that's the reason for running down the side. The wine spreads out and gives a huge increase in surface area for the vacuum to "work" on.
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Old 04-20-2017, 10:15 PM   #14
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Quote:
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Thin film degassing...that's the reason for running down the side. The wine spreads out and gives a huge increase in surface area for the vacuum to "work" on.
I hear 'ya, but that means the reason to bottle 'down the side' is to promote further degassing, and if the wine is already sufficiently degassed prior to bottling, there is no advantage to 'down-the-side' bottling under vacuum over splash-bottling.

If your wine is already sufficiently degassed, and if you are bottling under vacuum where oxidation should be less of a concern, I'm trying to nail down whether there is any subatantive disadvantage/drawback to splash-bottling over 'down-the-side' bottling.

 
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Old 04-20-2017, 10:29 PM   #15
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Originally Posted by fafrd View Post
I hear 'ya, but that means the reason to bottle 'down the side' is to promote further degassing, and if the wine is already sufficiently degassed prior to bottling, there is no advantage to 'down-the-side' bottling under vacuum over splash-bottling.

If your wine is already sufficiently degassed, and if you are bottling under vacuum where oxidation should be less of a concern, I'm trying to nail down whether there is any subatantive disadvantage/drawback to splash-bottling over 'down-the-side' bottling.
yes there is....down the side produces much less foaming when bottling, which in my mind, is reason enough.

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Old 04-20-2017, 10:36 PM   #16
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Remember that a vacuum is simply lower than ambient pressure. Depending on your pump, there is air and thus oxygen in the bottle or carboy. So while there would be less air and thus oxygen entrainment under vacuum, it isn't zero. So splash racking into a vacuum will entrain more air than a laminar flow down the side. It is the presence of gas pressure under the film of wine that creates foam.
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Old 04-20-2017, 10:46 PM   #17
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Originally Posted by Mismost View Post
yes there is....down the side produces much less foaming when bottling, which in my mind, is reason enough.
Foaming is bad if it results in inconsistent fill height, but does it cause any issues other than that?

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Old 04-20-2017, 10:54 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Johny99 View Post
Remember that a vacuum is simply lower than ambient pressure. Depending on your pump, there is air and thus oxygen in the bottle or carboy. So while there would be less air and thus oxygen entrainment under vacuum, it isn't zero. So splash racking into a vacuum will entrain more air than a laminar flow down the side. It is the presence of gas pressure under the film of wine that creates foam.
I agree, most home vacuum systems seem to reduce pressure to somewhere between 1/2 to 1/3 of ambient, and this ought to mean that the amount of oxidation you get when splashing in such a partial vacuum is ~1/3 - 1/2 of what you'd get splash-racking/bottling under siphon, right?

So is that the reason a laminar flow down the side is preferable, under partial vacuum or not? Is oxidation during bottling the issue you are trying to avoid?

 
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Old 04-20-2017, 10:57 PM   #19
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It is the one I try to avoid. I've never really grasped the "bruise" the wine issue, or at least ever had it explained to me.
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Old 04-21-2017, 05:11 AM   #20
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I agree with alot of the statements above -

Take any bottle of wine that is corked - commercial or homemade and shake it up . You will see foam inside the bottle - That is exactly what is happening as you fill your bottle. I like to keep all my liquid levels very consistent.

There are alot of people who bottle their wine too early and will get some CO2 out when bottling - but mainly I believe it is just agitation of the wine - so going down the side helps prevent this.

 
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