[davelochner]

The votes are in at home and we have decided to wait for fresh juice for our first red wine. After a little research and a couple of phone calls I am going with Mosti Mondiale Fresco Shiraz or Petite Syrah from Hammersmith Homebrew in Latham, NY.

As always, I have questions (someday I hope to have enough experience to answer them!)

First off what would you recommend Shiraz or Petite Syrah? We are indifferent between the two and would rather defer to people that have made both these varietals before, and if possible from this kit or something like it.

Second, would this be a good time to invest in a an oak barrel? If so, why? What style would you recommend? (French/American/Hungarian) I am on a 23L/6gal system here.

[robie]

I have made several Mosti kits, but I don't know anything about the Fresco product, so I can't say.

As far as which varietal, that totally depends on your likes/dislikes. Either one is a full bodied, heavy red wine. (Petite Syrah happens to be my personal favorite, but it kit form, tends to come out a little thin.)

Oak barrel? I'll assume you are just starting this hobby. If I am right about that, I would make a few batches before I invested in an oak barrel. A 6-gallon barrel will cost from $140 to $200 US dollars, not counting shipping. A smaller, new oak barrel like that can quickly over oak a wine, after only a few weeks in the barrel, so care must be taken.

Good luck!

[ibglowin]

Make what you like to drink. I don't think you will find too many people who have made either of those Mosti fresh juice products but you might get a hit. I would for sure dump a Cellar Craft syrah grape pack into either one you go with. Otherwise it will not have much solids or tannins (mouthfeel) all by itself. I also would hold off on a barrel until you are sure you will stay with the hobby. They are not outrageous in price but you do have to keep them full at all times once you start using it. I would just use the chips or beans that come with the kit for now.

[davelochner]

Originally Posted by robie

(Petite Syrah happens to be my personal favorite, but it kit form, tends to come out a little thin.)

Oak barrel? I'll assume you are just starting this hobby. If I am right about that, I would make a few batches before I invested in an oak barrel. A 6-gallon barrel will cost from $140 to $200 US dollars, not counting shipping.

Good luck!

Yes I have heard this about the PS which is why I've been leaning toward Shiraz, after that comment I think I'll go with the Shiraz.

I was also skeptical on the barrel, and will save that for a later day. I plan on doing something Italian with a long shelf life like Amarone, Barolo, or Nero D'Ovla and buying a barrel then.

Originally Posted by ibglowin

I would for sure dump a Cellar Craft syrah grape pack into either one you go with. Otherwise it will not have much solids or tannins (mouthfeel) all by itself.

Could you educate me a little on what these grape packs do/what are in them? I've heard them brought up a few times on here already.

[robie]

I have done both Amarone and the Barolo kits. My MM Ren Amarone with raisins is now about 18 months old and just starting to become drinkable. In another 6 months it should be where I will be willing to open a bottle with some friends, just not there, yet.

My MM Meglioli Barolo with grape pack is about 5 moths old. It is the darkest and fullest kit wine I have made so far. Even with reds, I usually watch the siphon tube so I can stop racking just when I see even a small amount of sediment being sucked up. This wine is so dark, you couldn't possibly see the sediment if it was there. Like the Amarone, it won't be drinkable until at least 2 years old.

I intend on drinking both these very slowly, so I'll still have some left after about 5 years. I don't know if from a kit, they will age as long as the commercial versions. I am sure they won't still be around in 20 years, but 5 is a possibility.

Being kit wine, both are a little thinner than I would like. The Amarone is already bottled, so it is what it is. For the Barolo, before bottling it, I hope to run it through a barrel to thicken it up a bit.

IMO, for these wines, if one is not willing to let them age for a couple of years, one would be better off making something else.

[davelochner]

Originally Posted by robie

IMO, for these wines, if one is not willing to let them age for a couple of years, one would be better off making something else.

I completely agree. Even though I haven't even finished my first wine I do know from buying commercial bottles that aging is a must with high alcohol content and complex tannin structure wines. I am all for aging and letting it sit in the basement until it is actually ready. The reason why I want to start this type of wine early in my winemaking career is because I will have to wait so long for it. I'd rather get it done now than wait two years to start and then wait another three for it to finish.

[robie]

Originally Posted by davelochner

The reason why I want to start this type of wine early in my winemaking career is because I will have to wait so long for it. I'd rather get it done now than wait two years to start and then wait another three for it to finish.

For me, age is a factor. Being near retirement age, intending to let a wine age for 20 years is not always a good idea. Last thing I want is for someone else to get the honor of opening that aged bottle, or worse yet, someone pouring it out.

They don't provide personal wine racks at old folks Homes....

[davelochner]

I don't think I'll ever make something that will benefit 20 years in a bottle. 5 to the early teens, definitely.

We recently invested in some Bordeaux wine futures; some of the minimum drink-abilities are forecasted at 2017. Talk about patience! Haha

[ibglowin]

Here you go:

Grape Pack

I won't make anything without a grape pack or similar anymore. Remember that a kit or fresh juice for a red wine at least was crushed and then allowed to cold macerate for a few days to extract the color out of the skins and then pressed off, rough filtered, flash pasteurized and sealed in a plastic bag. Even though the juice is high quality, its just not the same as fermenting on 100lbs of grape skins at 80 degrees for a week. The grape pack helps because it adds about 5lbs of skins so it will boost the flavor, solids (mouthfeel) and tannin level up quite a few notches compared to a kit or juice without a grape pack.

Originally Posted by davelochner

Could you educate me a little on what these grape packs do/what are in them? I've heard them brought up a few times on here already.

[davelochner]

I will most definitely purchase the Syrah grape pack after reading that explanation. Thanks for the info!